Well, it’s discussion Wednesday again!
This week we have a discussion that was suggested by one of our readers. It’s a topic that we really haven’t approached too much, though Linda did write a post about it several months ago.
Even so, many of you have expressed your feelings on this topic in the comments ever since we started this site. Usually the feelings expressed have been quite intense.
The topic this week is about your feelings toward the other person – your spouse’s affair partner. Specifically, we’re talking about hatred.
During this discussion, you might want to consider the following questions:
Do you feel an intense hatred towards the other person (OP)? Why or why not?
What effect has your feelings towards the OP had on you and your relationship with your spouse?
How has your hatred towards the OP affected your overall affair recovery and healing process?
Has your feelings toward the OP changed over time? How so?
Is forgiving the OP even an option for you?
Please respond to each other in the comment section.
Thanks to everyone in advance for joining in the discussion.
Linda & Doug
82 replies to "Discussion – Do You Feel Intense Hatred Towards the Other Person?"
I do feel intense hatred of the OW. It started off as fear and became hate very quickly. I think it’s because it felt like a personal attack for some woman to sleep with my husband when she knew he was married. She must have known what impact that would have on his wife when she found out so did it full in the knowledge of the pain she was inflicting on me, someone she didn’t even know (regardless of my H’s own responsibility for the affair).
Not sure what effect my hatred of her affected my H very much apart from that when I was in full vent mode and using the requisite language to describe someone like her he would get angry and defensive, because of his feelings for her he would respond in a way that gave me no doubt how he really felt about her over me.
I would say that once I focused on me and stopped obsessing about her and him, I hated her less. One of my good friends made me see her instead as someone to be pitied, which was helpful. It was helpful because it made me feel more like my compassionate self to see her as a sad, low self-esteem, low moralled, desperate and lonely woman picking up random men in hotels. So, over time I have stopped hating her as much as I did.
Forgiving her isn’t an option for me though. I prefer to give all my energy to people who deserve it instead. She deserves nothing from me at all. Sad, vacuous cow that she is…
I’ve been giving this subject a lot of thought this past week. I think that my feelings WERE intense hatred but am re-thinking that and feeling like that intense hatred is actually too strong right now. (1 year from Dday #1, about 6 months from my H finally ending things with OW) Maybe I just want some sort of ending, some revenge (I know that’s awful). I obsess about running into her somewhere, I want her to see that my H and I are better and stronger than ever, I would love it if she were miserable. Is that intense hatred? I really don’t think so, not anymore. Is it wrong of me to feel this way and to let it interfere with my everyday life which in turn hurts only me? Yes, I do think so. I’ve wanted to write her an e-mail so many times, letting her know that she has no hold on me or my H or my marriage anymore, but I guess if I were to do that, I would really be letting her know that she still does have some power, right?? Forgive her? I’d like to think that I can someday because I believe that I should.
I do not. Not because I have chosen not to do so. But I just don’t. Now, I no longer am a friend to this person, and this person understands that if he ever tries to re-establish a relationship with my wife, there will be hell to pay.
My circumstances are different, I believe, than many BS’s. My wife and her AP had ended their EA for over 6 months at the time I discovered that it had occurred as I suspected. Also, I confronted the AP and he admitted to his mistakes, convinced me that he was really, really sorry for them, and promised that he would never again act inappropriately with my wife. He admitted to still having feelings for my wife, but said that he recognized at a certain point in time that they were not true feelings of “love”. He convinced me that he did not become close to my wife as a result of problems in his marriage other than the fact that he was bored with his wife at the time and my wife was way more fun and exciting, something he recognized as easy for my wife since he was just getting to know her. Finally, he has since broken off all contact with my wife (he would not answer her calls or texts which frustrated my wife for awhile until she accepted that she would no longer have even an “appropriate” relationship with the AP).
Ironically, in two weekends I may be camping with the AP and his daughter with my youngest daughter and 8 other dads and daughters (if he doesn’t chicken out and skip the last group campout1). It’s the last time I will have to do this, and it’s the first time since EA discovery. We camped out twice together during the EA, and while I suspected that things were not “right” (he talked and texted with my wife during the campout, which my wife later admitted was something that eventually “woke her up” to the fact that they may have become more than “just good friends”). Since I’ve interacted with him a few times at social events and not beaten his ass, I trust that I can do the same during the campout. Sad, but he was one of the dads I enjoyed spending time with the most before the EA, but suffice to say that we will not be spending too much time together if he and his daughter do, in fact, attend the campout.
Initially I felt such an intense hatred that I was sure I wouldn’t be able to control myself. I figured out where he lived and seriously thought about just waiting outside his house until he came home and beating him to death. Fortunately I decided that I don’t like small confined cells and decided to go home and yell at my wife instead. As time has gone on I don’t hate him any more but I still have an intense dislike of him, enough so that if he every had the balls to talk to me I would probably hurt him. I feel no pity for him and will never forgive him as he is a serial cheater. I do feel pity for his wife though as she has to live with him. Most of the time I don’t even think about him any more and when I do I can just dismiss him from my thoughts.
Greg, I couldn’t have written this better myself. You captured every thought in my head. I’ve driven around for the past year with a Louisville Slugger in my trunk. Soon after the discovery, I had located his home address. Luckily he lives 50 miles from me. I hate to think what I may have done if he lived in the same town. Now, I don’t think much about him. But when I do, my mind can’t release it for a long time.
Mark, see that is why I havent told the OW’s husband about her and my husband’s affair. I am afraid of what he would do to my husband and my family. My husband and I are trying to work on US, but I remember the rage… even still feel it sometimes, that I had for the OW, and I think men are more prone to the physical act of rage, so… I continue to harbor their lie and don’t tell the OW’s husband. I feel soooo incredibly guilty and ashamed that I can’t tell this man what my husband and his wife did because I know what a fool I felt like for not knowing when I found out! I guess at least my finding out is what ended it… I just wish I would’ve called him up right away so that I wouldn’t have this guilty, and fear, if he ever DOES find out! I know way too much about the OW and her family… stalker info… It bothers my husband that I know so much, but my motto is that if he and I can’t work things out because I can’t get past this, then her marriage is going down too!! Revenge… sick but true! Why should she get to keep what she took part in ruining of mine? I was the innocent one – nobody asked ME if I wanted her in my marriage….Hopefully it’ll never come to that, but at least it gives me a sense of power – a replacement for the sense of power over my own life that they stole from me when they had their affair….
There are 2 OWs in my scenario. One was his partner in a 3 year PA many years ago which I found out about 3 months ago. I thoroughly despise her because she went after him and then did everything she could to hold onto him when he tried (not hard enough) to get away. Afterwards she emigrated and it is all a long time ago, so I have no way of catching up with her and telling her that no, they did not get away with it in the end. She did, of course, which makes me angry. I hate her because she came into my house and held my babies, was sociable, looked me in the eye and pretended to be a friend when she had shagged my husband in our bed. I didn’t think I had the capacity for hatred but this woman made me realise that I do.
OW number 2 really is to be pitied but she is a threat to me so I’m not sure how I feel about her. This affair is emotional not physical and it is pretty-much over except he is attempting to ‘let her down gently’ and will not be dissuaded. Their contact is extremely minimal but she is pursuing my husband and finding weak excuses to be in touch (they work together a little). I have spoken to her on the phone and witnessed first hand her damsel in distress act whilst lying to me through her teeth. I completely fail to see the attraction which is perhaps why I don’t quite hate her; I have my moments though. It’s him that I have a problem with in this case, I am angry at him for not knowing better after last time.
Yes, I hate her with such an intensity that sometimes I can’t believe it. Oh, I know my H is guilty of falling for her crap but I am still married to him so I had to figure out a way to forgive him. Her, nope, I know I will never forgive her. As Chiffchaff said, my OW set her sights on my H and went about getting him (and I do understand that he went along for the ride). She knew he was married and the stupid cow made sure that every time I was around my H at work that she popped up to see me. She didn’t really care for my H, just used him for her own advancement at work. I find her a lying, manipulative bitch who tried to ruin a family without a care in the world except about herself. I don’t usually give her much thought but when I do I have such intense feelings of hatred that I have to make myself stop. So no, I will always hate her, will never forgive and I hope I will never, ever see her again. She’s out of our lives and I want her to stay that way. And before you all lecture me, after D-day and my H refused to even talk to her at work, she turned her bunny-boiling attention on me, thereby solidifying my hatred. She kept up her assault on me for over a year. That had made me hate her for other things as well. Yes, I hate her.
I have tried to teach my children not to use the word hate so I would prefer a more repugnant word such as odium or abhorrence. They both sound much worse than hate and the second one brings an evil smile to my face. LOL On the serious side though my disgust for the OW is more than the affair. It is what she has done to me in as far as how I perceive other women now. Anyone who acts or looks like the OW I immediately steer away from. And that to me is more upsetting at this point. I look at it this way, the PA is over, I cannot change that fact but I can continue on with rebuilding my life and marriage. So what she has done is transformed me – a onetime “people person” – into an overly cautious perhaps even callous person when surrounded by people of her ilk. How unfortunate because the other women do not deserve my scorn… but that is what the OW has done to me.
Due to this hardness I find myself continually scrutinizing any female my spouse comes in contact with at work. In all fairness my husband has gone out of his way to introduce me to his co-workers, but that too is a mixed blessing. Now that I have met them, I feel as though one of them is exactly like the OW. I try to tell myself that it isn’t fair for me to place a red warning flag on her forehead when she hasn’t done anything to me or with my husband except be friendly. But then again that is how all this began. So I find myself loathing the OW for putting such pressures on me. It’s a vicious circle that is not easily broken and probably won’t be for a while.
I have a nickname… EVLRDHD. Does that explain where I am coming from? Forgiveness is not really in my vocabulary for much of anything right now but perhaps in the next millennium I might find it in my really small heart to forgive her. But in the meantime I just wish her the best and hope she finds her true love and he trashes her like she did me.
You know Battleborn, my OW did the same thing to me but on a much broader scale. I used to try to see the good in people and not over-think their motives too much. I got used. I got used by my H, by his OW and also by people I thought were my friends. It has made me cynical and suspicious now. I don’t try to help people any more and I avoid even discussing their problems (my friends ran the moment I found out about the EA and didn’t seem to care – now I don’t). I also do what you do – watch the women at my H’s work. I have warned him about boundaries and if I even think there is something inappropriate, I will confront the woman and him immediately. Not like I used to be either.
I agree with y’all — this experience has definitely heightened my awareness of my husband’s friendships with women. Before, I never would have questioned it but now, I know in the future that if I think he’s being a little eager about a friendship, or is going out with a friend often… I’ll probably get suspicious. I’m sure he won’t like it but then again, he has earned my suspicion and hasn’t yet earned my trust again.
Small heart? No. Sounds like you have a very BIG one.
143-286
Battleborn,
Each and everyone one of us is in control over our thoughts and actions.
Forgiving is the key to healing, it puts the past where it
belongs and frees you from all the poison of the past.
Those who anger you, control you.
By forgiving your husband and this other woman, it is very
powerful, because it frees you from carrying the past with
you and allows you to go forward with your life.
Forgiveness is the most powerful favor you could do for
yourself. Sometimes others do not care if they’re forgiven
or not. But at least you will be free from the past, by letting
it go, and you can begin to enjoy your life again with
peace love and joy.
I think hate is too kind of a word for how I feel about the OW. And until I came to the computer today and read battleborn’s comments above I didn’t have a clue about why this intense feeling was there inside me. It’s not because she reached out and manipulated my husband, almost made him lose his job and made my relationship with him a living hell. It’s not because she almost ended my marriage by worming her way back into my husbands heart. It’s because she changed ME. In a very profound way. And 3 years later I’m still trying to find that fun loving, caring, devoted – and mostly unparanoid – person that I once was.
My husband used to work long hours or go on long business trips and I would go hours and sometimes days without hearing from him. It never bothered me. We’d laugh and joke when we would finally talk. Now he’s not in contact with me for a few hours and sometimes my brain is certain he’s called her or reached out to her. Or she’s reached out to him. Then there is the way she looks and how when I do see it in other people I have a physical reaction to it and can feel the anger boiling up and whatever I ate recently starting to migrate right back up. And her voice… UG! Nails on a chalkboard (especially after reading the emails of how sexy he thought it sounded…)
So, after 25 years of marriage I had the rug pulled out from under me by an “old flame”. 3 years later I’m still smarting and want nothing more than have her gone completely from my brain. There would be no happier news that I could receive than to know that she is dead and will never show her face at my door. That’s bad, isn’t it.?.. And I was never this way nor have I ever felt this way about anybody ever before…
Noreunions – I have also thought that the best news I could ever get would be that the OW had died. Even though I know this would devastate my H.
I have also never thought that way about anyone before. That’s how bad EA/PAs are for the people affected by them.
noreunuions – I also wish both the OW were dead. I have never genuinely wished that on anyone before. I am aiming for a feeling that they are not worthy of my attention, I can’t imagine feeling anything but negatively towards them and that damages me.
I have also felt this way. Always hope when I hear about a fatal car accident in IT’s neighborhood that it is her… I don’t think THAT will ever go away… awaiting my Karma I guess… that way I don’t have to bare the guilt of knowing that she is living a lie with her husband and children because the OW’s husband has no idea about her affair with my husband…. at least when I am angry I am feeling SOMETHING… I don’t seem to be able to feel much else anymore….
In the begining of this I hated the OW with a passion. I had my H phone records so I texted her and told her off…(lots of swearing and digs at her character)
I think hating the OW depends on everyones personal situation. In mine, she knew me (not friends, just aquaintences) been to my house even!
She hung out at my H place of buisness (I told my H years ago I did not want her there *she is a social whore and pretty) She continued just popping by to chat(behind my back and against my wishes/feelings..whatever)! Then she moved across country and for whatever reason my H missed her and thought it was a briliant idea to call her. One thing led to another and the jackass thinks hes in love.
I know the OW has and never had any romantic feelings for him (she told me during one of our conversations) So I dont totally hate her. I do however hate her for continuing the “friendship” with MY H when she knew he started having those feelings for her…”Hes married you dumb bitch”
Why couldnt she have done the right thing and said “look, I like you as a friend but your married and shouldnt be thinking of me this way..We’re gonna have to stop talking, its not right…talk to your wife and fix your marriage”
This I do not understand. How she could continue if she had no feelings. I have yet to get the whole truth out of her to find out. But I will.
I also hate her for excepting gifts from him!!! Jewlery is not a gift you give your pal or recieve from just a pal!!! Especially Im sure she knew he hadnt givin me jewlery in 7 effin years (they talked about everything right)
So in conclusion…yes I hate her…but I wouldnt go out of my way to rearrange her pretty little face anymore! lol
Hate her very much. Hate what they both did even more. I don’t really like to feel that way. It is not a natural feeling for me. About a month ago during an intense breakdown by both my husband and I (both crying…torn up about what this has done to us) my husband said ” I don’t know who I hate more…myself or her. I hate her for her lack of morals and hate myself for getting sucked into it”. I must admit…I got quite a satisfaction from that statement. He should feel that way about himself. In the 30 years we have been married, I have NEVER heard my husband say he hated anyone. It’s better than liking her, I’ll take it.
I have to say that I am soooo jealous of you! I wish that my husband would say that he hated her, but I know that he wont. He has said that now he does not think she is a good person, but that was AFTER I asked if he though she was or not. I am taking what I can get. He doesn’t defend IT when I go on my tyrades about the OW, but he doesn’t say ANYTHING, so I don’t know really how he feels about IT now. I am afraid to ask. I do know that he has said that he regrets EVERY second he spent with IT, so am holding tight to that, too. Good luck! Just remember that YOU are the better person, and your husband doesn’t deserve you anymore, even if you did take him back. HE IS LUCKY TO HAVE YOU!
How long after the end of the affair and your effort to work on your marriage did your husband and yourself have the “emotional breakdown”?
while i’ll wonder about the integrity of the OW(s) if:
they knew he was married
they were not one side of the relationship triangle on any level
did not give him and me an STD
giving her any space in my head is not productive. I need to focus my energy on other things. Her participation in the affair was like role playing. She was just someone who won the audition.
last but not least, she made no promises to me. Dan said the vows, made a promise, broke my heart.
Knowledge is power! I NEED to know about her. I don’t feel very powerful right now. This episode should be a life lesson. I must learn from my mistakes, or I will be destined to repeat the same mistakes again . This is what I can control.
And even if she was not ” innocent”, HIS actions are unforgivable. I did not marry her. She will never be an essential part of my life. I’ll remove her from friend status on Facebook.
theresa, I cleaned it up for you. Is this cool?
The internet is a neat place to find out things about the OW… I know all sorts of things about IT that my husband didn’t even know!! LOL! THAT gave me power – to know where her mom lives if she contacts my husband again… a nice little note to her parents would surely do her in…. ;+)
The OW is very similar and very different from me, and it is both the similarities and differences that strike and bother me. For quite some time before DDAY and then afterwards, I hated how carefree she was with her sexual energy with men, I hated how much of a drama queen she is and how subtle and pandering towards men that performance is (she is no obvious train wreck and I think keeps most people at a distance, for fear they will see her true self which I think she secretly hates and loathes), I hated her and felt paranoid, weak, small, insecure, needy, and immature (or was made to feel this way), I hated that I wasted so much time comparing myself to her, I hated that she is so convincing in the fantasies she spins, I hated how little she cared for me (or my H for that matter), I hated that she lapped up the special attention she got, I hated that she spent so much energy sensing and then mirroring the fantasy my H desired …
Ultimately, I had to stop hating her, though I don’t forgive her. I stopped hating her because the hatred was toxic to me. I wrote her a letter that alerted her to the fact that I knew the truth, I listed the truth, I told her I blamed her no more than him, I did not directly name call or attack her, but that what happened was disgusting, adulterous, wrong, and selfish. Never heard from her and when I have seen her in public as I must do she has acted out like a wounded puppy / with hatred TOWARDS ME. What a lame-o.
Her public reaction was the beginning of me letting go and honestly it would’ve been harder if she HAD been gracious in any way. I thought, wow, she is another category of person who really does believe she is a victim here. How on earth is that possible! A little girl stuck in a grown body without capacity for self-reflection. No remorse, only ugliness and small-mindedness. No grace and no strength. No capacity for taking ownership. No true ability to see the role she played or her own selfishness. All she can see or could see during the EA is her own pain and depression and void and needs. She truly can’t see past her pain to recognize that she is a total dick. Odious, indeed. But also just sad and pathetic. I don’t feel sorry for her and do not like her. Seeing her as pathetic and weak, but also human, helped me let go.
So, I began giving myself back my own strength as a quality person, a beautiful person, a person who heals and helps and gives, and so on. I began caring less about what she looked like or what fantasies she spun for men. I know they are not true, at least in any sustainable and wholesome way. Anyone can maintain an illusion for a brief moment and I think it is unwise to chase illusory, shining phenomenon as a means of experience mongering.
So, my tactic has been to make her mean less. Put her in her odious place as a pathetic person trapped in her own bullshit. She will go own f-ing things up and remain incapable of truly intimate human relationships, so long as she believes herself as unique, special, misunderstood, victimized by a cruel world, blameless, superior human specimen awaiting some external knight or opportunity to finally, at last, deliver her to the land of endless love, adoration, and energy that she is apparently entitled to without effort or the weight of everyday life. She will put up little smoke screens of illusion and chase phenomena that she’ll taste fleetingly at great cost to everyone she comes in contact with. Meanwhile the people who might actually love her and her actual life will exist around her, crumbling from neglect and disrepair and abandonment and betrayal.
This is maybe a lie I invent to feel better, but it feels better than just hating her which I experience as blackness and toxicity in my own body and my own body has severed enough.
Enough OW.
Wow, I apologize for this self-indulgence.
Not down – Just had to say I love you screen name, and yes it does date me that I remember the original meaning of OPP. 🙂
Ok, I had to google it and I am lmao! 🙂
I absolutely DESPISE the OW. I swear if I actually ever did come in contact with her, I don’t think I would be able to control my rage. It is like I said to my husband the other night “What kind of MARRIED woman hits on another MARRIED man that she works with?” A slut, a whore, a horrible person. She has known my husband the entire 10 years he has worked at his job, and during that time she and her husband had kids, and my husband and I had more children… She KNEW!! She obviously didn’t care about him or his family, and didn’t care about her own. So yes, I HATE her! I wouldn’t be friends with someone like that, and wouldn’t condone actions of the like of my own friends, so she sickens me. I am insulted that my husband could even respond to come-ons by such disgusting filth. He NEVER defends her when I say nasty things, because he KNOWS I am right, and he also knows that excusing her behavior is the only way he doesn’t have to look at himself. I do have an edge to say nasty things though, as this is my husband’s first affair, but it was NOT HER first affair! She KNEW better. She IS a CHEATER and a LIAR and a WHORE. She was angry with my husband when I found out about the affair and he dumped her to work things out with me. She called him names…. that was a bonus for me because then he got to see that she never really cared about HIM, and I am at least thankful for that. She was only worried about me telling HER husband, which I still haven’t done – am holding that for the off chance that she tries to reconnect with my husband. We refer to her as IT – her name is not to be spoken in my presence. I am insulted and humiliated that my husband would be with such a person… My feelings have not really changed over time other than my rage and desire for revenge has lessened. I figure I have the upper hand now, which gives me the power that I felt that she stole from me in the beginning. I am desperately hoping that there is such a thing as Karma, as I have not pursued revenge, as I am a better person.
As for forgiving IT, that will NEVER happen, and I won’t even be forgiving my husband. I will accept what he did and we will move on, and the anger will continue to dissapate, and I am hoping that the loving feelings will one day return and I will be able to feel that I am once again ‘lucky’ to have my husband as my husband, but I can’t forgive. He knew how I felt about cheating. He knew that I had been cheated on before in relationships. He knew that my mother left my father when I was 3 because he had cheated on her. In my heart there is not a place if forgiveness for such cruelty… I will accept that there is nothing I can do to change the past and I will change myself… but I will not be forgiving. I didn’t deserve the shame and humiliation that they knowingly brought upon me. I can live with that. To say I can forgive either of them would be a lie. I am NOT a liar.
I still would not call it “intense hatred” of my wife’s “friend”. At first, I didn’t really blame the OM. When I found texts on her phone from him sweet-talking her, my dislike grew to a near “hatred” level, but I still know he’s doing it because she is letting him do it, and she wants it to continue.
How can I only hate him when my wife is 50% of the EA? I guess I feel like if I hate him, then I should be hating my wife too as she is just as much to blame and is as much a willing participant as he is. Sure, I think he’s a S.O.B. but how can I hate him for his part and not hate my own wife in her part?
I do not hate her~ in fact I don’t give her much thought at all. If any thing, I feel apathetic towards her. She used my H in a way that is so unacceptable for a woman as well as a woman-in-business. I feel for my H because as soon as she found out that he no longer had “her back” in business dealings, she threw him under the bus. I know how he feels as he now knows how he made me feel. In the beginning I did aim all my hate at her because I did not want to hate my H. By the time I finally was talking with my indoor voice, I no longer hated my H either. So the hate is just gone. Lucky for my H, the apathy I feel is towards her not him. 🙂
I would like to say I have no feeling about OM. But I think I am lying to myself. If he would die, would I be happy? Yes. If he were living next door would it bother me, HELL YES> The issue is he is 700 miles away. So my feelings are more focused at my W. What I do not understand is that one moment I love her and the next I hate her.
What really bothers me is that my W says he is just like me. That she found another me. WTH!!!!! If she wants me then why did she do this????
So I am confused. If I hate him, do I hate me? I cannot hate him. Not because of what she says but because it does me no good. I can say I have a disgust. I have a wish that Karma catches him. But I am spiritual, a nonpracticing Lutheran and I study Buddhism. If I allow this too be a hate, I am disconnected from the peace I seek. This has been a real trial of .my faith, anyone of them take your pick.
Right now the emotions I deal with are my own. They are within me. I cannot change anything but myself. I may influence other but cannot change them. I am focusing on me. On finding peace and someday maybe Nirvana. Until then I work on this day, this moment. That is all we really have is this one moment in time. What we do is our choice. If you wish to be happy then it is up to you to make yourself happy.
I am not telling anyone how to deal with anything. I am convincing myself.
Jim-Its funny that you say that…. “What really bothers me is that my W says he is just like me. That she found another me.”
My H said the same thing “she’s just like you…(and)…not talking to her anymore would be like never talking to you again”
But I found these statements to be totally false. If I were single (like her) I would never have carried on a friendship with a married man, especially if I knew he was getting feelings for me.
I think what the CS is referring to is they were formining a relationship with the AP and all the beginings of a “in love” relationship, like they had in the begining of “our” marriages. (gag…!!!)
I dont hate myself and you shouldnt either.
I also sympathise with how you hate your wife sometimes and love her other times.
Ive been dealing with those emotions a lot lately. Hate him and love him.
However it is getting easier as time passes.
I HATE HIM. My ex best friend who I told everything too. How we were having problems and he swooped right in there. Lives 4 doors down from us and now we are selling the house. April 28th it will be a year. When I found out I txted him to tell him he should kiss his kids goodnight and thank them. He txted back and asked me what was wrong, told him I confrunted my wife and she spilled the beans. If it was not for his kids things would have turned out a lot different. My wife does not truly know how she could have done that or let someone in her life. She admits now that he somehow brainwashed her with all the lies and deception. How I found out I had gotten a new iphone and was checking that i was not going over my txting limit and saw hers and said to myself that man she txts alot. And who’s number is that, Scumbags.
No, I don’t hate her. I actually pity her. Life has not been very kind to her due, mostly, to her own arrogance, ignorance and refusal to take responsibility for her own choices and subsequent actions. She has thrown away opportunities to grow and become a better person…first when her H had an affair and then during and after the affair with my H. Who knows where she would be today had she been willing to help her H and their marriage after discovering his affair.
She chose to run away from her problems instead of working on them and now she lives a very lonely existence. She’s cut off from her family, former friends, the financial security she had and a comfortable lifestyle…all because of her pride. She chose to view her H’s affair as an opportunity for her to leave the marriage. She spent the year waiting for her divorce to become final by abandoning two of her children so that she could ‘party’. The choices she started making seven years ago are now all coming back to bite her.
Can I forgive her? I believe that’s possible. She’s just such a lost, clueless soul. I know she isn’t my responsibility, but I still feel sorry for her. I wouldn’t want to be her. I’ve been fortunate enough to work through the pain with someone who cared enough to stay with me. We’ve both learned to trust each other in ways that weren’t possible before my H’s affair with her, and I feel sorry for someone who doesn’t get to have that experience. I really didn’t know how much I/we were missing before his affair. So, yes it’s possible to forgive her. That actually feels good to say.
Blue Sky, I always enjoy your posts. I wrote below about an accidental encounter with the OW. I surprised myself by not feeling the urge to unleash a verbal assault, but to just hold my head up and make my presence known.I had the same reaction you described: I realized that as painful as this has been for me, I’d rather be in my shoes than in hers. We have used this event to learn about ourselves and to improve our marriage. She is still alone, reduced to denying her identity on the street, and allowed herself to be marginalized by being the OW. She must not believe she’s very worthy if she was willing to settle for scraps.
I have also found that our marriage is entering into new territory and these changes have been very positive. The affair was an important catalyst for learning about ourselves and we’ve matured a great deal. As H says, it’s like version 2.0 of the marriage. I always believed–even through the affair–that our marriage and friendship were fundamentally good and strong. Not perfect, but solid. Going through this experience is a reminder that our commitment isn’t predicated on smooth sailing, but on our capacity to weather tough waters.
Anne,
How long has it been for you since D-day? I am still struggling, and it has been over 10 months now. I love my husband, am completely shocked that HE could do such a horrible thing (for 2 years), and with another married person to boot. I had always considered myself one of the lucky ones because I knew my husband would NEVER cheat on me, and I genuinely liked him, and he was my favorite person to be with on every level…. Until now… He worked and was going to school at night after work, and then we had sports with the kids every other night, and I was home but in school… I think that the distance for that year and a half before it started is what opened the door because IT could pay attention to him all day, and all evening when he would go out to work events (which were always at a bar). I didn’t know women attended these events, but never directly asked because I trusted him. How is it that you feel solid now? Even though she is gone from his work I am still totally paranoid that he will meet her somewhere for lunch or the like because she still lives in the area. He has given me access to his cell and his work email, and even his work voicemal, but he can delete what he wants before I see anything if he was still seeing her… and since it is a work cell phone, we don’t get to see the bills (BIG corporation – bills go to corporate office in another state). I can’t just show up at his work because I work too, and even if I could, it is a secured facility so I can’t even go to his office… how do you get to even a little bit of trust?
It’s been a year since D-Day this month. There were many ups and downs along the way. Ending an affair is a process, and that was a painful time for me. Both me and H see a counselor individually and we did marriage counseling for a time (individual has been more helpful for us). I feel solid now because he is truly a different person than he was a year ago. Through his counseling, he (and I) came to realize that while there were some issues in our marriage, this was really more of a personal crisis for him than it was a message to me. It wasn’t stemming from a desire to end our marriage. He was never going to leave me for the OW. He has used the months in counseling to get to the bottom of why he did this and to use this experience as an opportunity for growth. I have done the same. We then bring those lessons back to the marriage. I feel solid because I really see the changes that have taken place in him and in us as a couple. Hang in there. Keep trying.
How long has it taken for you to get to this place?
Hurt,
Yes the internet is a wonderful place to find out about people. I found the OW 2 weeks ago. I had previously searched for her but without any luck. She gave my H a good story that she deals with women that have had their breasts removed. She is so kind and has a big heart.(Blah)!!
In reality she owns an intimate apparel store and is a bra fitter. She has bra’s for women who have had masectomy’s. Well I got a look at this beast (WOW) from an internet picture with the name of the store she works at. Googled her name and more pictures came up. I even know what town she lives in. And 100% I believe that this E/A was just to catch up with an old friend for him.YIKES! My heart was beating a mile a minute. I feel like my hand was clicking the mouse with power from another sourse. It was like I had an angel on my shoulder helping me and easing my months of pain. I do beleive that he led her on because she did say that she shouldn’t have gotten rid of him. There was a void in our communication and I felt him slipping away from me even when I tried to get closer to him.
I do have intense hatred for this thing because she had no right texting my husband for years.Wishing him a happy birthday. He loved this ego trip. Yes, he is wrong too for never telling me. But we women have a pack and we don’t mess with married men. (at least some women don’t!)
I will go on the store’s web site and leave a review of the store warning all women to hold on tight to their husbands because she is a husband stealer.
I’m with you ChiffChat, If this women was hit by a train tomorrow, I would send myself flowers!
Yes. I have intense hatred for the OW who carried on a EA with my H. I hate her so much that I texted her. I called her. I yelled at her. I showed up at her work and humiliated her in her own place of business; about 2 weeks after finding the sexually explicit messages and texts on my husband’s phone (this is how I caught them).
I was 7 weeks post pardum when I found out that my husband had been having an EA, shortlived…6-8 weeks…the first contact with her was 2 days before I delivered.
I figure…why not make things as miserable for all parties involved; as they had made the time for me. I am sick sick sick that this situation happened at what was supposed to be the best time of my life and our relationship.
I feel abandoned, still, 8 months after D-day. I don’t give a flying crocadile how the OW feels about it. To this day, I am not sorry I confronted her. And I’m not sorry that I was a raging bitch to my husband.
He ruined the first weeks and pretty much my daughter’s entire infancy with this discovery. He claims that he was “being neglected, felt left out, etc” and he even went so far as to tell me that his attempt at going on 3 lunch dates with this woman; was “as way to get me back”…which I HAVE NO idea what that meant.
I hate him still for destroying the happiest moment of my life. I was told for over 15 years by specialists and fertility clinic staff that I would not have children. Our daughter is truely a miracle.
What did I see? I saw his lies to this other woman. He told her he had a “roommate”. He snuck around at lunch time. He did not help me with the baby the way I needed it. I was exhausted; I’m just not starting to get out of the fog.
If I would have played it cool; I’m sure I could have arranged for her to “come over to our house” for a little “fun”..and confronted them both.
I do not know her. I do not care to know her. I hate her. I hate him for lying to me.
I hate them both and I hate feeling the intense feelings of betrayal and abandonment when I most needed my husband’s love and support at this special, intense and bonding time period.
I’m still angry. And he’s not doing much in the way of being tender because I’m still acting out of fury at times. I’m tired. I’m in so much emotional pain that there are no words for it.
As far as the OW is concerned I hope karma finds her and I wish that when she is as happy as I was, before knowing about the lies and EA, that the love of her life pulls the same crap on her. If she were married, I absolutely would have exposed her to her husband and children. And since I couldn’t, I exposed her at work. She would not come to my table to talk to me (she’s a waitress; 37..two teenage boys…She’s nothing special… not even someone he would look twice at, plain and uneducated..not his type at all and not pretty in any sense of the word).
He says that he felt he couldn’t talk to me. I’m sure because of my “hormones”. I had never been pregnant..and I have no idea that I was treating him any differently.
What he was looking for was self gratification in someone admiring him; stroking his ego. It sickens me that this all occured just days before birth and it started up again when my daughter was 9 days old and went on for 6-7 weeks.
I hate her..yes.
Jamie – oh, I am so sorry you had to deal with this at what should have been the happiest days of your life. I hope your daughter brings you a bit of comfort.
At 8 months out from D-day, I think many of us felt the same way you do right now. It takes a long time to move forward, and that’s if your spouse is doing all he can to help you.
It’s been 18 months for me, and in that extra year that I have been dealing with this, some things have changed and some things haven’t. But it does get better. It will get better.
Take care of yourself and your little one.
Thanks DJ.
The thing is…I could have totally dealt with this situation with grace at any other time in my life than this time. I am/was the most vulnerable I’ve ever been in my entire existance and he exploited that…to his own selfish ends.
I’ve given up every single part of my individuality and autonomy to have this family and baby. And he didn’t even respect me enough to understand that the pregnancy and his “so called neglect” was temporary.
I gave up my body. I don’t mean to sound self centered here; but I was in the BEST shape of my life when I became pregnant…and I am proud of my body and sexy image; in general; but at this time, I was/am so vulnerable. I feel fat, ugly, lost and now heartbroken…
How can someone I love with my entire soul be so selfish??
Rachel, I did the same thing and used the internet to seach for the OW. Never underestimate the power of a jealous, betrayed spouse to find out all the details about the OW…turns out; just like your H’s EA partner…my H’s EA partner was a HUGE liar and farce.
And she even gave some BS sob story that her ex-husband “supposedly” used to abuse her (insert puppy dog eyes, stroke his ego so he will jump up and be her manly protector..what a crock of shit). She even told my H that she “carried a gun in her purse”.
Needless to say, my H was not impressed that I actually confronted her at her place of work, because he believed that she did carry a weapon.
Some weapon…tears and manipulation in her purse, more like it.
I cannot believe the lengths that some women will go to for attention; even from a stranger.
Jamie,
I forgot to mention that the ow’s H drinks too much and she hates that. Oh, poor baby. I said that he probably drinks to much because he’s married to her!
She also gave the boo hoo story that he has melanoma. Not sure if this is even true. She HAD to talk to my husband for comfort because she had such a scare. They talked in Feb. 2011 her scare was APRIL 2010!!! Is he really that blind???
I think I’ll send her a sun lamp for her birthday! Found that on the internet too! : )
Rachel, I’m so sorry.
It makes me disgusted that our H’s decide that some stranger’s sob story is so believeable and horrible…and decide they need to show empathy and understanding to a total stranger…when I’ll bet…just like me; you’ve been asking for years for him to be sensative and tender; i.e. empathetic to the person he actually married…YOU!!
I say ,send the lamp. I’m very vindictive. It’s not a trait I like. But if I am honest about it, it is something I possess to protect myself when I must. I’m generally a very very empathetic and kind person. I’m a Cardiac Radiographer…well, studying…super close to finishing. I LOVE helping people. My vindictive anger and fury is not a triat I enjoy posessing; in fact it’s something I’m working on to rid myself of; a bit of a hubris, but I will tell you this….I was a whole hearted- loving, devoted, affectionate, blindly trusting wife and this is exactly what it got me…heartache and pain…during the birth of my miracle child.
I don’t believe I’ll ever forgive him for having an EA, even if it was “harmless” (as he puts it) at this time in my life; because I was abandoned and he reached out to someone else that means nil….to him…some stranger he met at a group lunch meeting with some of his collegues. Some trollup…who craved sympathy.
Send the lamp, Rach…send the lamp.
Wow, NotOverIt & BattleBorn…i can sure relate to your posts…well said. When i turned to my Catholic faith as my life preserver following Dday#1, even that was difficult to hold onto and became a trigger as my H told me his AP was raised a Catholic! I couldnt even say the name of the Holy Spirit in prayers for over a year ( as that was the name of the High School it attended.) i hate this thing for its false representation of my beautiful faith, for not caring that ” thou shalt not kill,” nor ‘thou shalt not covet they neighbor’s husband/ as is his case with me,’ ( as it went after married men, killed any offspring vs. use of birth control.) of course this was all known by my H during the affair (picture a dense fog here.) ithis thing truly was/ is the devil.
And i may have to one day forgive my H for all this pain (which i assume i am excruciatingly working towards with my H as i am still with him albeit not 100%.)…but i have accepted his affair and this creature as a part of my history now. But forgiving this OP who has a death wish ( mine is not the 1st family it has involved itself with,) is not on the horizon. I hope God understands. I know i can never be the Catholic i want to be because of my feelings here…that pains me too. My priest tells me i should pray that this thing will change, so that it can never again hurt any other family as its hurt ours…that seems do-able…
But like you NotOverit & BattleBorn, i too intercede in any probable or potential looking inappropriate relationship i see coming, on my H’s behalf…no more being caught off guard again, for him nor for me.
Special note to NoReunions, ChiffChaff & NW…i used to read the obits each day to see who i knew who passed….now, i only look for that one name….
Changed Forever,
I want to offer you some words of encouragement.
Please for your own sake, forgive your husband and his
affair partner. Forgiveness is for you. God asks us
to forgive others who have hurt us, the power of forgiveness
frees you from carrying the baggage of someone else’s wrongs with you everyday. It frees you to move forward and
leave the past behind.
The priest is right, pray about this, and let God begin to
heal you, and yes you can be a good Chistian woman.
Jesus died for all our sins, and if God forgives us for our
sins, he asks us to forgive others also. We are not above
this, by not forgiving your allowing your pride to stand in the
way, of being obedient to God.
I know you hurt, but when you forgive healing comes.
Keep praying and studying your Bible, and don’t let someone elses affair stop you from Your Love walk
with the Lord. NO affair or anybody is worth this.
Your walk with the Lord is the most important relationship
you have. So someone elses wrongs should be forgiven
so your not filled with the poison it brings, instead your
free to live from someone else’s wrongs, and your relationship with God grows.
I love all the descriptive verbs here for the feelings we have for the affair partner. I can use them all for my feelings for my husband’s OW – abhor, despise, hate… how about detest and loathe? Yes, they all fit.
Like Notoverit, I found a way to forgive and live with my husband. But for the OW? She deserves to be hated. She pulled all the tricks, too, like other OWs. She knew she would hurt both her family and his, but she didn’t care. And yet she always tried to come across as the sweet, caring little damsel in distress. Of all the wanton, despicable, unconscionable people I have ever seen…
I do not spend time working myself into a frenzy over her these days. I hardly think of her at all anymore. But I would not say that I simply dislike her. No, I hate her alright.
Is that unfair? I have made friends with a number of cheating spouses, both in real life and here online. How do my feelings for her fit with my feelings towards other cheating spouses? Well, when I look at cheating spouses, I look at how they handled themselves overall. Are they remorseful? Have they realized their mistakes? Have they worked to make amends? I see none of these in her, and so she will not get any olive branches to seek peace from me.
If I ever came face to face with her, I’d probably punch her lights out. I used to daydream about throwing a glass of soda all over her and then giving her a black eye. And I know how to do that, too. But no, she’s not worth the time to daydream about anymore. Just keep me away from her.
It’s so interesitng that this is today’s topic.Last Saturday I was walking through town by myself and I passed the OW walking in the opposite direction with a friend. We have never met and I only recognized her from pictures I saw online. Anyway, she didn’t notice me and I walked past her and then turned and followed them for about a block (she was talking about a date she had been on the night before–glad to hear she’s moved on!). She and her friend went to get a coffee and I sat on a bench outside.When they came out, I called her name. She turned around and said hello and took a step toward me, trying to place who I was. I stood up, removed my sunglasses and said, “You’re Jane Doe, right?” at which time she recognized who I was. She shook her head and tried to make it look like it was a case of mistaken identity, but she had already given herself away by responding to her name. She and her friend scampered around the corner and that was the end of it. The honest truth is that after all the fantasies I’ve had about the withering remarks I would make if I saw her, I had no desire to cause a scene or to be nasty. I just wanted her to look me in the eye, to see my humanity and know that I’m not an abstraction but a living, breathing human being. Mission accomplished. I could tell she was rattled (so was I), but I feel very good about how I handled it. I’ve never done anything in my life that has made me feel like I need to deny being who I am. I was able to hold me head up without shame. I’ve done nothing wrong here. She knows I’m not a milquetoast and that I didn’t let the moment pass when I had the opportunity. Now, everytime she goes out, she’ll have to wonder if I’m going to turn up and say something to her (after all, she had a friend with her and that didn’t stop me from addressing her). I have felt a lot of anger towards her in the past, but this actually gave me a bit of closure. Our marriage is in a much better place. She’s not a threat to me–and she never really was. The affair has been a catalyst for growth and change for me and H, and our marriage is benefiting from those efforts. I’m still on a high about the whole thing. On Monday morning, I looked on my LinkedIn account (you can see who has viewed your profile), and guess who looked me up? I had to laugh…
Good for you Anne!!!
It feels good doesn’t it?
I didn’t make a scene either, when I confronted the OW.
I took a table in her section; and she would NOT come over to me…knowing it was me from the text picture I sent her in anger, days before.
So I sat there for 20 minutes; with my infant daughter; then I left and sat near the host stand. When she went past I said her name. She looked over at me; and I told her to stay away from my husband….I made a point of saying…”my husband”. She was surrounded by her coworkers and none were looking too impressed when I picked up the carseat; put on my sunglasses and sauntered out the front door of the restaurant.
I do NOT regret making her see me as a living, breathing human being..and I don’t regret confronting her in that manner.
I say, “good for you Anne!!” Pats on the back.
I’m thankful for this discussion topic because it’s given me the chance to spend the day thinking about how I feel about the OW. It’s easy for me to say I hate her, but I’m not sure that’s true. I hate what she did, I hate that she’s unwilling to accept responsibility, I hate that she still seems to be playing games with my husband.
In my case, the OW was our best friend. At first I thought she was wholly innocent in the EA (that it was one-sided) and then I learned that she realized my husband had feelings for her and did nothing to disuade. In fact, she escalated things (though she never told him she reciprocated). She tread that line where she could say, “I did nothing wrong” but that when you put it all together it’s a clear case of her encouraging his feelings (what single woman would go to dinner and a bar with a married man and invite him (drunk) into her house for more drinks at 2:30am when she (a) knows he has feelings for her and (b) knows his wife is out of town?)
Anyway, I feel betrayed by her. I don’t think she was really considering the consequences of her actions. But she was one of my closest friends and she should have stepped back from him (she still hasn’t, not really). That’s not to say I don’t recognize my husband’s role in all of this — I do. But I’ve cut her from my life completely — I don’t need friends like her. I just wish my husband would do the same.
In the end, I feel a lot of pity for her. She played with fire and (deservedly) got burned. She’s the one who is alone, who won’t grow from this experience, and who will likely close herself off even further from the world emotionally because of it. She’s the one who, even though she denies it, knows she compromised her values, hurt her friends, and is capable of being a horrible person. To me, her dealing with that realization is punishment enough. It’s never fun to disappoint yourself and she gets to live with that for a long time.
Of course… in a month I’m running a race with her and my husband. I have *no* idea how to handle that — it will be the first time I’ll have seen her since D-day (my husband works with her so it’s not as big of a deal for him).
Oh, I forgot to ad (sorry my posts are so long… sometimes it feels like journaling) but I did feel intense hatred for the OW at first and it caused a lot of problems between my husband and I. At first he refused to see her role in any of it, refused to think poorly of her, refused to understand why I was so betrayed by her (because, according to him, she did nothing wrong). He continually wanted me to sit down with her to “resolve our issues” and I think part of that was his desire that we could all somehow be friends again (HA!). He falls into defending her which drives me insane.
But recently we realized together that it’s about power when it comes to the OW — she wants to be the one to define the terms of their relationship so whenever he makes it clear they’re not friends, she tries to lure him back in. For some reason, realizing that and having my husband see it as well allowed me to get over a lot of my feelings toward her. It made me feel the pity I mentioned above.
Will I forgive her? She hasn’t asked for it, so I haven’t given it. She’ll never ask for it — she doesn’t think she did anything wrong. Honestly, I think the best thing I can do is fully write her out of my life and out of my mind. Hating her — having any feelings toward her at all — gives her too much credit and too much power. She isn’t worth it.
WriterWife…I wish I could say that…”she isn’t worth it”…
I wish. My H’s OW is a nobody…but what I hate most about the entire situation is that I have turned this whole EA thing inward…on myself. I hate me now; for his EA…and I’m so confused. I hate them both.
I hope I can get to the point where I only think about myself and my own happiness.
Good for you for rising above the situation and really digging in your heels and thinking about YOU…FIRST!!
Jamie — I know how you feel! The first thing I said when my husband told me about his feelings for the OW was, “I’ve never been interesting enough to hold anyone’s attention for very long.” I was consumed with the question of what the OW had that I didn’t (and I even asked my husband and he answered – ugh). I hated myself too — I even thought “I’d have cheated on me too.” I think that’s something we all go through.
I think there’s an important balance that I had to figure out as a BS — I had to acknowledge my role in our marriage becoming strained, BUT I had to learn not to accept *any* responsibility for my husband straying. After all, we were a part of the same marriage and *I* didn’t feel the need to have an affair. There was a great post a few months ago that basically said: if the CS was unhappy, what did they do to try to fix the marriage before starting an EA?
After D-day, I spent a lot of time (and struggled with!) trying to remember what I told myself a lot before I got married: I can only be myself, if someone doesn’t love me for that, they’re not worth it. But the issue was that I had to focus on being my best self. I did a lot of soul searching to figure out who I wanted to be *for myself* and not for my husband. I thought there was a very real possibility I could end up single again and I wanted to do so feeling strong and with self-confidence. I struggle with trying to remember this every day.
I found out three weeks ago that my husband was having an “emotional affair” with a coworker. A coworker that was an acquaintance of mine, and that actually attends our church. These have been the three hardest weeks of my life!! I just stumbled across this blog when I googled “emotional affair”. I am on this rollercoaster right now. One minute, I want to make this work with my husband, and then the next minute, I hate him! The hatred I feel toward the OW right now is ridiculously intense. I did verbally tell her the week I found out that I forgave her…because I didn’t want her to have that bitter hold on my heart. However, I am having trouble following through with my words! I should add that I am a strong woman of faith…or so I thought before this happened. I am actually a leader at my church in the kid’s area! I am just so devastated right now. My husband just doesn’t seem to grasp the depth of my hurt because “nothing physical happened”. I’ve tried to explain to him that this is worse than if it were physical!
Jennifer — I’m glad you found this site! This has been an invaluable resource to me over the past few months (and I found it the same way you did – there are lots of great posts in the archives). I also found a lot of help in marriage counseling and reading books (Doug and Linda have a list of great resources to check out).
I did the exact thing you did — as soon as I found out about the EA I said, “Oh, I know the OW didn’t do anything wrong, I’m not mad at her.” And then, as my marriage counselor said, my reality shifted as I realized that she did do something wrong. That’s when the roller-coaster began. I think that the first weeks/months after D-day are *so* emotionally intense it’s just about surviving. Don’t be hard on yourself — give yourself grace, compassion and understanding first, before giving it to the OW (and even your husband). You need to take care of you and take the time to sort through your feelings (because it does take time).
The “nothing physical happened” defense is hard to deal with. It took my husband months before he’d even consider the words “emotional affair.” And this is even though before we got married we both defined affair to the other so we’d know and I defined it as emotional.
Writer Wife, that was actually a really good couple of posts. Our OW happened to be a good friend of ours, too, or so I thought, so I relate to your situation. That’s why I helped her with her son, who is very full on, and she couldn’t cope with him (needed to say no one or twice, and stick to her guns, he had her wrapped around his four year old finger!) That’s why I invited her to so many of our events/parties/holidays. Apparently, she told my ex that we were never friends, after she told me via text, all about their 15 months of hot sex and deep love, lol! I felt a little sorry for her, she was a single mother (by choice, she stole semen from a sex partner’s used condom, spergling, is the term coined for this, lovely!) and I don’t know why I felt sorry for her, she had a great corporate job, had lived all over the world, owned a beautiful home, etc, etc. I felt sorry for her beause for all her wealth, and “worldliness” she was lonely, she’d never had a relationship, of any length (funny, that!) and wanted one, desperately. Of course, I felt some kind of “hatred” for her, and still have moments when I am overwhelmed by the intense wish that she knew, or rather cared, what she did to me. She doesn’t, at all, in fact, she told people I deserved it, as if things were good at home, and I was a good partner, and good enough in bed, etc, it would have never happened. How to make you feel even more inadequate than you already do! I, of course know that what they did was not my fault, in fact I was the best damn partner I know!!! My ex says I did very little wrong here, he just got lost and flattered by the attention while I was trying to re-establish a career after 14 years at home, working in his business (for no pay!) I have worked my butt off to get to a place of forgiveness, I forgive him now, but I don’t really forgive her. I would like to, because I know you forgive for yourself, not for the other person (so her asking for forgiveness is irrelevant.)
In my worst nightmares (I have lots of hideous images playing in my sub-conscious, while sleeping, if I get much, mostly sexual/rape/torture of myself at their hands) I also have stupid moments of wanting to drive up to her house, and spraying weedkiller words into her front lawn, spelling out for all her neighbours to see, the names I have called her in my mind – mostly starting with C – a word I never use!
Wasting your energy on hatred is not helpful, but I haven’t really found a way to let it go properly, much as I would love to.
I realized a few weeks after D-day that I have a key to the OW’s house and I had a moment of thinking, “What if I just went over there one day when she was at work?” I’m still worried that when I see her next (which will be around co-workers of theirs in a month) she’ll say, “You’ve lost weight,” and I won’t be able to stop myself from responding, “It’s amazing the motivation you can get when you find out your close friend is having an affair with your husband.” But I also know I would instantly regret it and my husband would be mortified that his co-workers knew (that’s his big terror right now — people realizing he and the OW rarely talk at work after being best buds and asking what happened).
I’m hoping the hate will go away with time. I notice I feel it less often and less intensely now and I hope that trend continues. I cut and paste a lot of my favorite quotes from this blog and I always come back to this one:
“Holding onto resentment is like swallowing poison and hoping the other person dies”
At first I hated her. Intensely. I wanted to blame her for the whole thing, for it to be her fault because, ridiculously, I didn’t want to hate my husband for what he’d done.
I used to write her letters in the middle of the night when I couldn’t sleep, never sent, full of bile and anger and hurt.
But then I saw that what I was doing and feeling wasn’t helping me at all. It was filling me up with a poison inside, and I saw that if I let that continue it would destroy me. I am a good, kind, caring person. There’s no one I hate. I didn’t want to give her the power to change who I was. So I actively made the decision that I would change my feelings towards her.
I have contacted her twice since then, by email, with my husband’s knowledge. Both times I was very calm and not horrible. I just explained how I felt, told her that I had tried to put myself in her position a little, to attempt to understand her, and that I wouldn’t put all the blame on her because I knew it was my husband’s fault too. She did apologise to me, whilst also saying some things that hurt me too, but she at least acknowledged her wrong-doing.
It isn’t always easy. Sometimes I get the most horrible flashes to things he’s said of what happened or things I’ve read and that anger comes rushing back and I wish, momentarily, that I had sent her one of the angry, full of swearing letters instead! I’m not perfect – I’m just trying really hard.
I haven’t forgiven her yet. But when I do it won’t be for her that I forgive – it’s for me. I can’t live my life, or have a good marriage, if I’m carrying around that much anger and hate inside of me forever. So, when I think badly of her I just say ‘stop’ in my mind and then I think ‘I wish you well *****, I wish you well and happy’ and then I do my best to think about something else.
We’re only a couple of months from D Day of his EA/PA and they are still in a weird sort of contact situation, so I know all of this is subject to change, but I truly felt better when I let that huge amount of hate go. She isn’t worth it. I have a beautiful daughter, my son is due to be born next month and I am a good person. It doesn’t matter what fantasy he has in his head about her – I know that she chose wrongly, she made a bad decision, she was selfish, she was disrespectful and SHE is the one who has to live with that for the rest of her life. I only have control over me. I cannot change the past, I cannot change my husband, I can only change me.
And I choose to make myself better, and be happy.
Anna, I also have contacted the OW, with a very thoughtfully worded letter, no blame, nastiness, etc. I just said it would be good if we could talk, as I wanted to forgive her, and explain what the effects are on the couple that has been affected by the affair, and on me, personally, and the relationships I have with all of my other friends now. I called in at her home one day, I did text her to say I was going to, but left when she opened the door, and asked me to (F&%^$ off, you stupid b%$^#!) without any fuss whatsoever. She just angrily texted and phoned my ex to say she was being harassed (one letter, and one very polite call, in six months, as opposed to all of the texts and emails, coarse, accusatory grafitti sprayed onto a lodge we have at the back of our farm – don’t know who did that, but she is suspect number one – we got from her for over two and three quarter years!) and he needed to stop me, or she would call the police. She even went as far as to send me a restraining order. It was fake, I have two years of law school behind me, so am not a complete idiot, lol, and could see that it was downloaded off the net, and didn’t have one police signature on it. I got the message already, she is not capable of understanding of my situation, or of showing me or my children any compassion, I don’t know why I ever let her into my life??? Silly, silly, sad little girl. That’s when you see her for what she is, a spoilt brat, who tossed her toys when she didn’t get her own way. My ex says she just could NOT believe she didn’t get him in the end, she looked at him when he told her that they were finished like something did not make sense. How could his hideous partner have beaten Ms Fabulousness??? And guess what, even now he is available, he doesn’t want her, damn!
I really do have to stop this, I have to build a whole new life now…
I posted earlier how I felt about the OM but what I cannot get past is the jealousy. Granted D-Day 3 was only 12 days ago. But I am not normally a jealous man. Now my W says I never trusted her.
I did have jealousy issues when we were first married but I consider that normal new couple stuff. After a while it went away. She has went on trips without me and I have had no problems. I never checked up on her comings or goings or where she was.
Even after D-Day 1 in January I did not get overly jealous. I was but nothing as consuming as now after D-Days 2 and 3. Now I cannot get past a couple hours wondering if they have talked or texted today. I have her email (2 accounts) and Facebook passwords and I fight with myself not to check them daily. I admit I have checked them and she is either being truthful and not contacting him, she is not emailing or being good at deleting them. In her one email account there are emails that she had before D-Day 3 nothing earth shattering but she just left them. He is even still a contact in that account.
How do I get past this obsession to check? I feel like I am setting myself up. I feel like this has a control over me that I cannot break. I really want to trust her but…. Is my need to check that I want to gain trust or is it that I want to catch them again?
How did you defeat or fight off the green eyed monster?
Jim – The obsessive thing is perfectly normal and will ebb and flow, as will your definition of “trust”.
Your comment:
” Is my need to check that I want to gain trust or is it that I want to catch them again?”
I think it’s both. When you have one of those, as I call them, “heightened awareness moments” you need to check. When you don’t find anything you can either think (a) I’m so glad that she’s being trustworthy and not in contact with that OP. or (b) Alright, I didn’t find anything, but that doesn’t prove anything because she could have a secret cell phone or another account or… and my brain is positive that there is something up.
If you do find something it’s really important to analyze for yourself what led you to that “heightened awareness” and give her time (hours, not days) to confess to you before you confront. It’s not a green eyed monster that is inside you. It’s a knight that wants his damsel to remain faithful to him and only him…
I’m years from D-Day, not days. I can’t say the mix has changed all that much over time, but I can say I’m not as obsessive about checking as I was in the beginning. However, I will always check. And you should too. And she needs to delete this guy from her accounts and get rid of all the emails and… It is up to her to show that she is back in your marriage with both feet and up to her to restore some level of trust. But, I’m sorry to say, you won’t ever “trust” her like you did before. And that is good. That’s you protecting yourself and your marriage.
Jim, the need to check will go away but not or many more months. I got to that point after about 7 months or so where I didn’t have to check daily but even now I will still get the urge on occasion and just have to check the phone reords.
I thought about some of the comments here most of the night. One thing that I know is that the reason I have anger is that the OW is still a threat. If you perceive the other as still being a threat it is only logical that we want to eradicate them so we can have peace. In a war situation, which this is – a war on your marriage – you have an enemy…
So, if there is no contact, then how is it still a threat? In my case the OP is a a total self absorbed nut job that is positive that I’m living the life that SHE was supposed to live. She’s H’s old flame from high school. You know “first love” that was “my one and only true love” and all that crap. At any rate, she will occasionally still send emails or notes to my H declaring her love and that she’s “waiting” for him. Or some stupid one sentence “I miss you” note. He’s even changed jobs and she’s managed to track him down.
I really want to be like Anna. And some days I am. I am very happy with my marriage. It is better now than it ever was. I want to pity her, and I do, but it’s not a compassionate pity, if you know what I mean. If something triggers thoughts of the OW, the anger and hatred rushes right to the surface. I have tried to mentally interrupt that from happening, but I can’t catch it in time before I feel my heart beating faster and my fists are clenched.
I too hate the other woman. our family unit has been completely destroid. My husband is so into this woman. I don’t think he cares about what happens to me or the children. I should not hate her because she never made me promises. But my husband did. I messaged her on Facebook to leave my husband alone. she never messged back. I say The Hedge Of Thorns Prayer daily. it gives me some comfort and hope.
Hate? I’m not sure if I hate the two OM or not but I’d love to beat hell out of both of them, just for general principle.
I know where they are and I’ve learned quite a bit about them and their habits just in case they attempt to contact my wife again. I’ve said nothing to them so far and don’t plan too as long as they stay on their side of the fence. I guess they don’t know how lucky they really are that I have a rational sense of doing the right thing even if they and my wife didn’t consider what was right.
No I’m not going to hate them… that would give them too much power over me.. but I’m not going to lose or give what is mine to them without a fight!
I said this in a post last week, but I’ll repeat it here:
I believe most of our ‘hating’ of the OP isn’t hate at all. It’s fear. The OP represents losing what we hold precious. They came close to taking our spouse, and in some cases they were the ones that ended it, meaning those spouses would still be involved with them given the chance.
They represent the uncertainty in how our spouse truly feels about us. Are they here because they love us, or because the OP isn’t around and we’re better than no one.
The OP represents all the lies. They were there for the lies about us and they were the reason we were lied to. They were the ones listening to all the problems our spouses had with us, and they were more than happy to sympathize.
And, let’s be really honest, they represent the deepest jealousy any of us have faced. They got the sweet nothings from our spouses. They got the cutsie texts, the “I love you”s, the late night calls, the loving side of our spouse we rarely, if ever, see. They got what we wanted and should have been ours.
They represent what many of us deep down believe our spouse really wants. Someone they can be open and romantic with, someone they enjoy being around, someone they’ll lie to see or talk to.
So is it hatred? I don’t think so. I think it’s far worse.
These statements do NOT apply if you were friends with the OP.
WoW! Livingonafence-Thats exactly how I feel. The deep jealousy but its far more than just jealousy.
I hate everything that my H gave to the OW…the romantic side of him Ihavent seen in years and really wanted.
I finally came to a relization..in my situation the EA was one sided…the OW had no attraction to my H, like Ive said in previous posts, shes a social whore. So now Im feeling like Im the runner up in this situation. She had no feelings for him. Im left wondering…what if she had? would he have given up our marriage for her. I feel like hes just settled for me because he couldnt have her…bad day for me!
It is worse than hatred, and yes, it’s much more like fear with jealousy and resentment thrown in for good measure.
I am lucky that the OW lives so very far away. I am very aware that had she lived in this country I think he would have left when I discovered it to see if there realyl was greener grass over there. The distance meant he had some fairly huge practical problems to address before he could do anything like that such as family, job, money. So the ‘fear’ is that if she pitched up with a job in London things would very quickly become quite different, I’m sure. My H is still very weak and still so very far behind me in terms of developing himself after what he’s done. This is what stops me thinking that the way it is right now is something to be trusted.
Livingonafence,
Your so right it’s much worse than hatred.
yes. loaf, you nailed it here. this really helps.
I don’t hate the other woman. However in the beginning
my feelings towards her were not much different then what
any other betrayed spouse felt.
Romans Chapter 12 verse 19 says ” Beloved do not avenge yourselfs, but rather give place to wrath; for it is written, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay,” says the Lord.
For myself this is more powerful by putting it into God’s
hands, and I forgave her and moved forward with my own
life.
It was my exhusband who was married to me and it was
his job to remain faithful. Part of his wedding vow was to
forsake all others. However he didn’t.
God asks us to forgive others, so I did, and now that part of
my life is over and I refuse to let their past wrongs be a
baggage of unforgiveness in my life.
My life is more important then carrying someone else’s
past wrongs with me everyday.
The power of forgiveness is so freeing.
Do I hate her? Hmmm…I don’t think so, since I’ve never met her. Can I truly HATE someone I don’t know?
Do I hate her actions? Oh YES!! I can’t understand a woman like her…she has NO remorse for what she has done, evidenced by an email she sent 7 months after Dday. telling me she has done nothing wrong, and she holds her head up high!
Her H found out about 3 weeks before I did…he found a text on her phone that she forgot to delete, anyway, after he found out, they stayed up ALL night talking, she poured out her complaints to him about why she wasn’t happy…then 3 days later found a way to text my H without her H knowing!
I don’t like people like her, male OR female…dishonest and selfish, and would NEVER chose someone like that as a friend!!
I feel sorry for her because she will never be happy…I mean seriously, how can you cheat on your H, and then go behind his back and continue cheating…and then say you’ve done NOTHING wrong?
No, she’s not a happy person, and I’m SURE she makes her H an unhappy person also. How can he be happy, when she had a EA and isn’t even sorry for it? I feel sorry for her kids, living in that kind of household, with a mother like that…sad cow that she is!
I do not have intense hatred of the OW. I am sad. Bewildered, hurt and betrayed. I considered her a friend if not a close one. She is a stay at home mother of two who feels neglected by her H. I knew they had problems in the past and I shared with her how I felt invisible. Within a week she began flirting with my H and their month long texting affair began. My H had quit his Prozac cold turkey and was at a low – he is still in the throes of a midlife crisis. She saw her opportunity. My H never wanted kids and I supported him for two thirds of our marriage – there was no hope for a future for them. How my H admired her for sacrificing him for the good of her children! She declared no contact within two days of my discovery. She told multiple people she was in love with him but never him. She also told those same people he left me. They are also involved with our company so there will be no obliterating her from our lives. She destroyed my life so easily. Do not get me wrong, I blame my husband equally. But her betrayal seems so wrong to me in other ways. As a woman I think we owe each other some loyalty. As a wife who felt unappreciated by her workaholic husband… I gave up having a family to be with my husband, I have infertility issues but had I been married to anyone else I would have adopted. How could someone with two precious children who gets to have 6 hours a day to do whatever they want not be grateful and respect their life? On top of that, I had just showcased her talents in one of our productions and even used a large sum of money from my svings to fund it. And she lied to me when she dropped off facebook. My H hates FB and she dropped of it because she was getting all her positive reinforcement from my H thru 600+ texts. I hate how they have made me feel. I hate that I now see any other women and wonder if she will be the next whose smile turns his head. I hate how her interference has changed me from a trusting person to a suspicious and scared person who no longer trusts anything, not even myself. I am angry that she has her life intact and I may lose the two things I value most: my H and the company. If my H and I are not together, I cannot be around him. So it is all or nothing for me. I hate what she did but not her. I never want to see or hear about her again. The mention of her name makes me want to vomit. If my H and I end up divorcing, I will get closure by sending her a note. My H and I are separated and for now I cannot give her any importance. I am owed an apology I will never get.
My wife’s EA/PA was my best friend. There isn’t a day that goes by that I don’t want to destroy him – not physically, but emotionally. It isn’t a good way to live, but for all the pain he caused by trying to take her from me and pollute her feelings about me and our marriage, I do want revenge. On the other hand, I know that I need to let this go and even forgive him someday…but not for his sake. It would be for me. I do not want to carry around that bitterness forever.
I’m right with you, Dave. But, in my case, it was a physical revenge I craved for a long time. Thankfully there is distance between us. If he were closer it would be torture.
On D-Day #1, I wanted to hurt him physically. I wanted to kill him, but the day I caught them, I couldn’t. I was holding a tire iron, getting ready to destroy her car. As she walked out his door, I rushed towards them. I don’t know what my intent was, but I was filled with rage.
I was fully capable, more than strong enough, and ready to beat him within and inch of his life – but the look in their eyes, I stopped dead in my tracks, dropped the tire iron, and drove home home sobbing like crazy.
I’ve never been so heartbroken in my life – except when my wife finally revealed all the details including the fact that she fell in love with him. On D-Day #2, I was once again filled with rage, but thankfully for him, he lives half a country away now.
How many D-Days did you have? I had three, maybe 3 and 1/2 D-Days(depending on the definition) lol.. Every one of them was just as heartbreaking and anger inspiring as the last. I still have a baseball bat in my trunk. My wife sees it, but assumes it’s just for baseball. (I’ve played and coached for years) I have no intentions of using it, however it went in the trunk the day I first discovered the affair. Now, it’s like a reminder to me to stay vigilant and never to let me be made a fool of again.
I’ve had two so far. The first one was the day I caught her leaving his place, in July 1998. She lied of course and said nothing happened. That was the only true thing she said. Nothing happened – that day. It was the day she broke it off with him.
D-Day #2, this New Year’s Eve, she confessed that not only did she have an EA, but that it was also a PA and long-term. I also recently found out that while the “love” part was only a month or so, they had been together on occasion as far back as 1994. (Yes, it was 13 years ago, but they’ve had contact during that time through letters and FB.)
So, my expected D-Day #3 is getting the rest of the story, which is expected any time now. He’s sending a box with all of their “memorabilia” – photos, negatives, audio tapes, letters, etc.
Do I hate the OW? Let’s just say I would unplug her life support to charge my phone!!!
I used to feel an intense hatred but it was harming me so much I just had to make the decision to give it up. This was very challenging, but it was the best for me and my adult children. it doesn’t mean forgiveness. But I think at some point you have to distance yourself from the pain and focus on yourself as a survival tactic, but this takes a while. And it helps to think that you are better off without such a loser anyway.
Do I hate her? Fortunately I don’t know her name, never met or seen her. I think that helps. I am happy to de-humanise her by calling her a ‘pet’ name. I feel such a mix of emotions. Range from Hate to pity. I think my H was scared of her telling me, so the EA went on for lot longer than it had real feelings attached. In saying that my H should have ‘grown a pair’ and stopped it at one of the many chances he had.
The hate was that she knew that my H was married with Children and grand-children. Hate that she was a willing participant. She used bad situation at her home to get pity from my H and he fell for it.
I also feel Pity because my H seemed to lead her on. Allow her to think there was a future. As soon as I found out, he told her it was over. So for 2.5 years she thought she had a relationship, but really she as a distraction. So for that I pity her. Not enough to tell her that though!