microphone For the time being, we’ve decided to stop our regular weekly discussions that we’ve been running since 2010.  However, we will still be posting the ‘Open Mic’ discussions each month.

So once again it’s that time.  This is Open Mic #12 and we hope that there are some things that are going on that you can either ask questions about or share your experiences with everyone.

So…

  • What’s on your mind?
  • Have any successes to share? Big or small.
  • Got a question?  Ask it.
  • Do you have any problems or situations that you’d like the community to offer their opinions on?
  • Any good books you’d like to discuss?
  • What are you and/or your spouse doing to further the healing and recovery in your relationship?
  • What’s working or not working?
  • Has your therapist given you any good advice or exercises that the rest of the readers might benefit from?
  • Fall is here.  What are some of your favorite fall activities and neat places to go?

Please don’t be shy.  If there is anything whatsoever on your mind, please leave a comment below.

Thanks!

Linda & Doug

 

 

See also  Discussion – What is the Current State of Your Marriage?

    106 replies to "Open ‘Mic’ Discussion #12"

    • Doug

      I’ll start things off this morning.

      I thought this was curious…A neighbor has an affair after 25 years of marriage. He divorces wife stating her alcoholism, smoking and general bitchiness as reasons for affair and divorce. He marries affair partner whom we meet at a block party and were surprised to discover that she drank like a fish, smoked like a chimney and was basically a classless bitch. The only difference from his ex-wife was his new one is about 10 years younger. I foresee trouble ahead!

    • blueskyabove

      It just goes to show you that when you’re looking to blame someone else for your unhappiness you’re likely to find a justification for your choices and actions.  After these past few years, I’ll bet you would just like to smack him upside the head and tell him his life and happiness are his responsibility.  Chances are, though, he wouldn’t believe you.  People just seem to have to learn the hard way.

      • Doug

        You got that right BSA. Linda and I are often out and want to smack some of these people upside their head – especially her brother. But that’s a different story all together. Good to hear from you. Hope all is well!

      • Rachel

        So true blue.
        When my ex was looking to divorce me he gave the excuse that my parents didn’t have a lot of friends. Hello….. They are in their 80’s!!!! Most of their friends have passed away.
        So I guess I should thank my parents, since my life is sooo much better without that jackass.

      • Doug

        I found this interesting: “Husbands in general rated their marriage satisfaction higher than did their wives.

        But their marital satisfaction had little to do with their overall satisfaction. What drove men’s overall satisfaction was their wife’s marital happiness.

    • Tryinghard

      Doug
      How did you and Linda keep from laughing in his face?

      One of my husbands gripes was that I played words with friends at night instead of talking to him. Um, yeah, because if he was awake he wasn’t talking to me and only watched TV and if he wasn’t watching TV he was sleeping in his chair! Of course I played words with friends I was bored stupid.

      The thing is if they want out any story will justify it. He was making up his narrative as he went along. I’d venture to guess he’s a big drinker and smoker too.

      • Doug

        I didn’t know whether to laugh or call him a dumb-ass, but I’m thinking the sex must be real good (or it was) because she was a real piece of work.

      • Strengthrequired

        Th, one of my h fries was that I was on the ipad too much when he was home. Same as you, he either was asleep, or watched tv, or was too busy on his phone, and would not talk to me, so I too was bored senseless.
        Yet hey, she saved him from all that. Lol. So why is he still here then? Lol

      • exercisegrace

        Standard cheater bullcrap. My husband complained that I read too much at night. He wanted me to watch TV with him instead. So I was the bad guy for wanting to just wind down reading a book while he watched TV (sitting beside each other in bed, mind you). I should add that he only watches about ten minutes before he is snoring!

        Generally, this is called “grasping at straws”. Please, by ALL means, if you have a real complaint let’s hear it. But if you just want everything YOUR way, ALL the time? Step. OFF.

    • Strengthrequired

      Doug, I’m not sure where I ousted last and you responded, but I wanted you to know I read it, but just didn’t have a chance to reply. So in response I wanted to say Thankyou, and it will be a work in progress, I will be trying very hard to find that happiness and light within me again.

      • Doug

        You’ll get there SR. I’m sure of that!

        • Strengthrequired

          Thankyou Doug, funny thing happened today, I was down my local shop, and the shop keeper looked at me and said, you have a good year ahead of you, this year is good for you, I can see it in your face. I said, I have to admit, this year has been a lot better than the past few years, but I do hope your right, that it turns out to be very good.

    • Strengthrequired

      I have been thinking, lol, what’s new? Anyway, I found out recently that cousin it has found god again, going back to her faith. Now all I could think of was, so that means god will forgive her for all she has done. So she gets off Scott free for her trying to destroy my family. Funny that, she gets to destroy lives and then she ends up living her life like nothing happened, while I live it still every day. Doesn’t seem fair. Ohhh well that’s life I guess. Lucky her.

    • tryinghard

      EG
      Yes grasping at straws and rather pathetically at that.

      “You had an affair and had sex with another woman and lied and spent thousand of dollars on her for how long???” “Well, well, umm yes, but you played Words with Friends and read books. What’s a man supposed to do???”

      Seriously, if it weren’t so pathetic, it would be hilarious. You can’t make this stuff up!

    • Jim

      My wife has been in an emotional affair for 10 months with a single man who works abroad for 3 months at a time and returns back to the states for a month. In July my wife told me she had told him to end contact because it was creating too many problems at home. He returned to town last week and they have seen each other every day. She won’t give me a straight answer why she went back on her word, other than to say she needs the friend right now. She says she would never leave me for someone else and that these type of relationships never work out. She is seeing a therapist 3 times a week. We had a very broken marriage for 14 yrs , a lot of blame can be put on me. She feels terrible abandonment and resentment toward me. Still I feel it’s overblown.. Need advice, backing off is soon hard!!!

      • Jim

        Jim cont….backing off is sooo hard…I hate auto correct… Our 14 year marrige has not been totally broken just very sexless and rough economic periods we had to endure. As far as me to blame maybe I was being too critical on myself, my wife blames me for the affair because of our prior struggles..we seem to be in a much better place than when the affair first started and she finally took herself to therapy just 1.5 months ago to deal with our issues. She keeps texting me she prays she can turn it around and come back to me… The latest incident of her restarting the affair proves she is still very much in the fog…my fear is that only seeing him every so often slows the process of getting out of fog…

        • Strengthrequired

          Jim, I have been trying to think of what to say to you. Now as for backing off, I think you are the best judge of that. You need to do what is right for you, but I also think you will know when the time is right for you to do just that. Your wife is playing a game that is unfair. She knows that her relationship with this om is not going to last, but still does it anyway, just like many other cs here. My h kept his ea/pa going for just over a year. It was the longest agonising journey I have ever been on. At first I wanted him to realise that I loved him, as well I didn’t want the ow to get my family, so I fought for what was mine. Now I have to say, that after a while I kept coming to points where I was ready to leave, yet my h at that point was wanting his marriage, so kept stopping me. Unfortunately he kept his relationship going and kept lying, so there were several ddays, and each time it just deflates you even more than the first dday. Eventually as I mentioned he stopped. The problem was, that it wasn’t up to me to stop his relationship, because no matter I did or said, had no effect, he would say he stopped, but would find a different way to keep lying about seeing her, so what I am trying to say, my h had to be ready in himself. Which he is lucky he did, because when he did I was already at my wits end, and felt like I had nothing left to offer him, so he knew I wasn’t going to take anymore. I think it was then that he realised what he was going to lose.
          I know it is hard to step back, when all you want is your marriage to go back to normal, where there is no third wheel, but you will know when the time is right, for you. I actually think that it’s a good thing the om isn’t around all the time, it gives you time to get closer to your wife, when they are around all the time, it makes life so much more harder. That’s what I believe anyway, my h ow was around all the time, he was always with her, it was like she was attached to his hip. I think that is why it was so hard to get through to my h. I believe if she wasn’t around as much, we could have more time to repair our marriage and she would have been gone a lot sooner.
          That’s just my thought anyway. I do hope your wife wakes up soon, I know how hard this is for you, I wouldn’t wish this on anyone.

          • Jim

            Thanks SR for your kinds words, it certainly helps to hear from someone who has been there!! I agree I wouldn’t wish the pain an affair crates on anyone!!!

        • Doug

          Hey Jim, Don’t let your wife convince you that the affair is your fault. Perhaps your marriage wasn’t the best and you may have played your part in that, but so did she, and she is the one who chose to have the affair because of her issues.

          • Jim

            Thanks Doug, hopefully her therapist will help her realize that as well!!

            • Strengthrequred

              Jim, hope all works out for you, I also hope your wife’s therapist can help her see clearly and to stop doing anymore damage to your marriage and start helping you save it.

          • Lynn

            Jim-

            Hubby did the same thing, blamed me for withdrawing emotionally while he drank like a fish and was basically a mean ole grouch.

            He chose to “get what he needed” rather than talk to me. It was easier for him to portray himself differently to the OW than to deal in reality….

            Your wife sounds amazingly like him,. BTW, it wasn’t until I sat him down, months after the initial dday, and told him I couldn’t believe his justified attitude, selfishness and arrogance, and it was not working for me, and he would have to leave, that he broke down and began reconciliation.

            Of course there was more that he did not own up to as far as OW and their activities went until months later, but I do feel that w/o my standing up for myself, reconciliation would not have been possible.

            He needed a shake up to wake up, and he is awake now, Thank God.

            Hoping for the same for you!

            • Strengthrequired

              Lynn, it’s amazing how much the fantasy of the affair takes hold of the cs. Shaking them out of the fantasy is a tough job, one that’s takes strength and courage and a lot of love but someone has to do it.
              Like your h, he needed several wake up calls, yet each shake woke him up just that much more to see the ow what she really was.
              I showed him a picture of the ow the other day and he couldn’t recognise her, thought it was someone else. Strange… To be so besotted by the ow, to not really see her. Lol

    • Strengthrequired

      I saw this quote somewhere, author was unknown.
      mistress – something between a mister and a matress… Lol

    • Strengthrequired

      A happy marriage is the union of two good forgivers. ~Ruth Bell Graham

      Trying and exercise grace – this quote is for you. Lol
      Before marriage, a man declares that he would lay down his life to serve you; after marriage, he won’t even lay down his newspaper to talk to you. ~Helen Rowland

      After a few years of marriage, a man can look right at a woman without seeing her — and a woman can see right through a man without looking at him. ~Helen Rowland

      Men never know how tired they are till their wives sit them down for a nice long talk. ~Mignon McLaughlin, The Neurotic’s Notebook, 1960

    • Doug

      Can someone please tell me why it is necessary to camp out overnight to buy an I-Phone 6? I don’t get it. I’m pretty sure Apple has made plenty of them.

      • Jim

        I still can’t figure out Black Friday after Thanksgiving???

      • tryinghard

        Oh Doug, Doug, Doug!!! Have you not learned anything??

        Don’t you know that people realllly want that which they cannot have? Don’t you know that anticipation is greater than realization? Fantasizing about holding and using and loving that shiny new iPhone 6 is just within you reach and you’ll finally be able to rid yourself of that tedious and out of date iPhone 4 or 5. That new iPhone 6 is going to make your life so much better than that ragged, old iPhone 🙂

        Kidding of course, but I’m sure you get the idea?

        I call it the Cabbage Patch Doll marketing strategy. Remember back when they were all the rage of Christmas one year and then there was a shortage and it was all over the news that you couldn’t buy a Cabbage Patch Doll anywhere? Suddenly people who never had any intention of buying a Cabbage Patch Doll wanted one! Grandmothers were stealing them out of the carts of other shopper just to get one. There were fights and mayhem over those stupid dolls. Well brilliant marketing strategy on the part of the Cabbage Patch Doll company, right?

        I just this week went up to the Verizon store with one my employees to get a new iPhone 6. They weren’t in yet and was informed we could come and stand in line of Friday to get one.

        Yeah, NO. We ordered one and it’s being sent to us.

        And no I don’t do Black Friday either, EVER. I don’t care what kind of “deals” they are having on flat screen televisions.

        • Doug

          Ha! Now I think I’m gonna run out and buy an I-phone 6 right away. I’m excited!

          I guess I just don’t get all the excitement – or the need – for that matter to do such a thing. Where is our priorities? People’s cell phone usage is a pet-peeve of mine to begin with and I’m sick of seeing people walking around with their noses buried in their phones all the time. Hell, where my girls go to college you almost get run over by all the kids who are walking and don’t notice you because they’re fixated on Instagram or Snap Chat or some such crap. I hope this doesn’t offend anyone but there’s so much more out there than what’s on your f&^%ing phone!

          OK. Rant over. Back to Candy Crush 😉

          • tryinghard

            LOL, I know! Man I think I need to run out right now and get my place in line of that 6 as well. My 5 just doesn’t do it for me any more! I think I really need one. I mean I love my iPhone 5, I’m just not in love with it any more 🙂

            I am so sick of all the smart phone activity. My H phone rang off the hook last night. We have LOTS of stuff going on and are up to our noses in work, but I seriously wanted to throw that phone off the deck last night.I’m afraid on day I just might.

            Don’t even get me started on the younger generation and their phone habits.

            Hello people, it’s a great big beautiful world out there. LOOK UP!

            OK gotta go, they just called my number to get my new shiny phone……

            • Doug

              You’re funny. Have fun in line. I’m heading out to take my dog for a hike in the woods! Sunny and 70 degrees outside and it’s Friday!

    • Kimpage

      I was successful last week. I finally got my husband to sit down with me for a very calm, organized question and answer period about his affair. I have been waiting, researching, educating, and calming myself since April’s D-Day. I thought his stonewalling was going to kill me but in the end it only made me stronger. I was actually able to sit there right in front of him and let him talk to me about her, the sex, the coverups, his guilt, his shame, his love for me, his alcholism and addictions and none of it hurt! I mean I didn’t feel physical hurt anymore only finally clarity and then peace.

      • Doug

        That is awesome Kimpage. Can’t add much more than that!

        • Kimpage

          Thanks Doug. I owe a BIG thank you to you and Linda for helping me get through this awful, painful, wonderful, empowering experience. I was finally able to look at all of this from a different perspective and I have forgiven him and asked him to please forgive himself. We are reconnected, caring, loving and there is no more blame and hurt only empathy and new growth.

          • Doug

            Thank you for the kind words. I really sense your excitement for the future possibilities in your relationship. Again, that is awesome!

            • Strengthrequred

              Kimpage, congratulations for a huge step forward.

    • Lynn

      Just got todays email, clicked on 6 ways to tell if you should stay or go, and it was just an ad to buy a program. Linda and Doug-did you realize that? Tired of being hit w links to ads ads asking to purchase a program, rather than getting info. I know you market things at times but just thought this was misleading. JMHO.

      Anyway-I am in a state of uncertainty right now, coming up Fall which was when my CS began his affair. lots of triggers….tired of this “gift” that keeps on giving.

      What keeps those who stay going? Saying “I love him or her” just isn’t enough for me. I love chocolate, but it doesn’t mean if it was bad or hurt me somehow I would eat it until I was sick.

      Just a cynical day for me I suppose. Thanks for listening.

      • tryinghard

        Lyn

        I hear you. I clicked over too and saw that it was from the Ottos. They don’t do much for me so I didn’t even bother looking at their information. They might work for others though, just not me.

        In this whole process you have to take what works for you. There’s so much info about infidelity out there and I’ve read at least 20 books in my process. I think I could probably teach a grad class on the subject!!

        Going through this healing process, whether you chose to stay or divorce, no one come out of this unscathed or totally convinced of their decisions.

        One thing I can add is if you are deciding to stay and reconcile the one main question to ask yourself is, Is your life better with or without the marriage? We all question ourselves. We all have egos that say, WTF are you thinking? We all want some sort of pride and dignity back. But you must remember and know that only YOU can restore your own sense of ego and pride. You husband nor your marriage can do that for you.

        If you and your husband are making progress and your relationship is good then enjoy it, trust that it’s real. If your gut is telling he is still carrying on the relationship with the OW than by all means look into it and put your foot down. Draw the line.

        Yeah love is great but it certainly isn’t everything. Maybe try making a list of everything that is working for you in the relationship and then that which is not. Work to change those that aren’t.

        I don’t know how far out you are in this process. I’m three years and trust me I’ve changed my mind more than I care to say. But I’m here and sometimes I just take it day by day. I can say though that there have been more good days and less triggers as time passes and I get smarter.But I’m done getting smart and truly relaxing and enjoying my marriage and relationship with my husband.

        It’s ok to be cynical. It’s normal but guard yourself from becoming bitter. Let the cynicism flow through you and then put it aside for your own sake. And remember his affair says NOTHING about you or your marriage but everything about him. So do his efforts at redemption and reconciliation.

        You’re going to be fine, I promise 🙂

        • Lynn

          Thank you, tryinghard. He is not seeing the OW. She was part of his withdrawal from alcoholism. You know, trading one addiction/escape for another.

          He has made a lot of personal changes and has finally gained sobriety, is treating me so much better. Snarky part me says good for you, at my expense, you azzhat!

          I really shouldn’t have anything to complain about I guess. Except that he has tainted our marriage and his character and I can’t forget it. I get closer to forgiveness and then I am triggered by something and he is impatient w me, goes into a shame spiral and can’t be there for me, it becomes about him, again.

          So the wounded one tends the woundee! Just doesn’t seem fair. Of course life is not fair. Guess I am whiny today, IDK.

          Thank you for your thoughtful response.

          • tryinghard

            Exactly Lynn!!!

            Yes you do have a lot to feel anxious about. Don’t lie to yourself about that. But in the same breadth you have to get really smart about both the alcohol dependence and the infidelity. It’s a lot to deal with. Don’t minimize you task. Thing is, he can’t help you with either of those. Maybe if he were further along, and I hope desperately for you that he is still in therapy for those issues HE has, you could relax a little.

            That said, he can’t even soothe himself with rational thinking because his history tells him to turn to booze or another woman. He’s breaking hard habits and lifestyles. This choice to make a better life isn’t easy for him either. And as you know recovery and reconciliation is NOT for the faint of heart.

            I’ve found that when I need “answers” I turn the question around to myself. In other words, what do I need to know about me that makes my circumstances livable and acceptable. It’s hard when it’s so easy to just get angry and direct our snark and vitriol at the cheater.

            Also quit putting yourself under the pressure to forgive. Once I gave that up, and also the notion of moving on, I felt free. Everyone wants to say, forgive and how it benefits you more. Well I say bullshit on that. No it doesn’t, especially if you try to do it too soon. And besides, what is forgiveness really? My idea of forgiveness certainly is not yours or anyone else’s.

            You have to get through each day as it’s presented to you. Each hour or minute if you have to. Right now I am fine. Everything’s good right now.

            LOL a lot of times I think OY if he could read my mind!!! Think wicked thoughts or thoughts of revenge or whatever, let them rip and then come back to reality.

            You’ll be fine and don’t give those triggers the power they do not deserve!

            • Lynn

              Tryinghard-

              You are right, so very right. What you said about forgivness is very true-and yet, how can we have a healthy marriage if I don’t forgive him? I am taking it in stages-first step:Accepting that HE and ALL OF US, are imperfect human beings.

              He always refers to “circumstances” while I refer to “choices” no matter what the circumstance! I bled my heart out on the Sober Recovery site forum for a while. Took him a long time to accept responsibility rather than blameshift. which hurt even more. He lied to our therapists and to me for a long time after he was caught.

              I asked him to write a letter to them, which he did, but they have yet to be printed out and mailed. Did I mention he has ADD too?

              It just feels like he always has some “circumstance” that has to be considered, and I am the logical, rational one in the end. The heavy lifting largely done by me. Being a social worker, its in my nature and my day job to problem solve, which I think gets taken advantage of.

              Jeez I am rambling on. Didn’t mean to hijack the thread. Oh and FWIW, I too think it is so silly, camping out for days to get an Iphone, those folks need to get a life! 🙂

            • Doug

              Hijack away, Lynn. That’s why it’s here!

            • tryinghard

              Well I don’t know about you Lynn, but I AM pretty damn perfect!!!

              LOL just kidding. Yeah we all have to look how we contribute to all our relationships not just marital, right. Also you can lead a horse to water but you can’t make him drink.

              I bought so many books and would outline them and hand them to my H and suggest he read them to only be disappointed when he didn’t. Then I realized, you know what??? he’s a big boy. If he wants to read, he can make that choice. I’ll be damned if I take on the Mommy roll of read this, do this, do that, eat your spinach, brush your teeth!! Let it go. He heard what the therapist said. He’s choosing not to do it. That may or may not be a deal breaker for you.

              Yep, I was the heavy lifter, but I gave it up!! Enough is enough. Protected him, made it all easy for him, arranged his closets and drawers, took care of EVERYTHING. Not so much anymore and I like myself better this way. You are NOT doing him or yourself any favors by doing the “heavy lifting”. Seriously, let that go! Do heavy lifting to please Lynn, not your H or anyone else. You don’t owe him anything but you do owe it to yourself. You are all you have!

              Learn to say NO, and mean i when you feel like it. I learned it the hard way because in the end, no one really appreciates it.

              Let him play around with his semantics. You however always stick to calling a spade a spade. Ask him what he means by “circumstances”? Put the onus back on him. Don’t interpret. They use words like that to soften their actions. Well guess what pal, YOU created those “circumstances” with your choices.

              I think you’ve probably forgiven him somewhat, on some level. Maybe just not how you are feeling pressured by society on what forgiveness is. Make a list of everything he needs to be forgiven for and tell him the ones you are struggling with.

              OK, sorry for the rant. Hope I’ve helped. I hope you go outside and enjoy this beautiful almost fall day. Life is Good!

      • Doug

        Sorry about that Lynn. Didn’t mean for it to be misleading, but after re-reading it, I can see what you mean. Point well taken!

        Anyways, sorry about the triggers and your current state of uncertainty as well. Try to remember to be good to yourself during this time.

        • Lynn

          Thanks, Doug.

    • Strengthrequred

      Lynn, th always offers great advice. Did you see the ADD post, if you haven’t check it out.

      Th, yay, so happy for you. Life for you will just keep on getting better and better.

      Ohh and as far the the iphone 6 goes, I think they can stay in queue themselves. I think by the time I end up getting my iphone updated it will be after the one billionth one is sold.
      Everywhere you look someone is on the phone, talking or texting, did you hear about the new footpath lane I think in china they created just for the people using their phones?

    • Tiredofitall

      So I am feeling emotionally disconnected from my h currently. We have been very busy recently with work and child obligations so that doesn’t help. In the next fee weeks it will be the 2 year DDay anniversary which leaves a pit in my stomach just saying it.

      But, that being said, what I really need some input on is a reoccurring scenario that always seems to bring on this feeling of disconnect. My H is doing most things right although I still long for him to communicate with me like I imagine he did with “her”. . He is saying the right things, he is loving and kind and I am physically attracted to him. But what happens is-I become happy. AND-although that seems like it should be a good thing, it actually sends me into a major sort of depression. I remember that 2 years ago at this time I was fighting/recovering from breast cancer, had a wonderful loving husband that took care of me and our family and that I trusted with my whole heart and soul. I was so happy and secure and glad to be alive. Fast forward to me now—–and every single time the doom and dread of the EA starts to fade and I feel happy, I have a kind of flashback and something happens that takes me right back to that place where I trusted my husband with certainty only to find out that he was involved with another woman. These are worse than triggers and I do not know what to do. It is almost like a voice inside me that warns me not to trust him. Does anyone else have this happen? I almost feel as though I am doomed to sabotage my own happiness. I don’t know if I am strong enough to get over this and feel safe enough to be happy. I need some feedback please.

      • Strengthrequired

        Tired, I do get what you are saying, I’m guilty here of the same thing too. I’m wondering if it is me not trusting myself to know that it is safe to let my guard down, so it stays up. I feel the same way, often think I will sabotage any chance of being happy with my h, because it’s safer to be on guard then to not be.
        In a way I think it is a normal reaction, we have been hurt, traumatised, and that pain is hard to shift, I know even now, I still suffer from constant chest pains, and I would have thought it would have gone by now, especially that I feel better, well much better than a few years back when I had my first dday. I don’t want to feel that pain again, so giving my h that part of me again is a struggle, so I guess that’s why I feel that when I smile I shouldn’t because if I let myself be happy, and comfortable and content, something may crush me again.
        Maybe that’s what’s happening with you too. That’s all I can think of with my situation

    • Flowergirl

      Tired,
      I felt this exact way this week. My thought on this is that we don’t know if these happy days and times are authentic. We had happy days during the affair period. Yet our husbands were doing bad things at the same time. My husband was texting his b*&$! While watching the kids. We just dont know what is real or not real, true or not true. Is a happy time spent with our spouse only a facade. Are they fantasizing about someone else? I get it!

      • Strengthrequired

        Flower girl, your right too. I wish recovery from this wasn’t so hard, yet it is, and if I ky our cs had of stopped when we asked and found out, and didn’t lie, instead of covering up their steps, and lying about it, and getting found out several times to just still keep trying to hide it, maybe recovery wouldn’t have been so long and hard.

    • Tiredofitall

      Yes, you are both right. Along with another worry I have which is IF I allow myself to be happy (which I tried at first and was hit with a second DD) so if I allow myself to be happy and I find out my H is cheating again, I am truly truly truly fearful that I will break. I think of it this way and have told my H this. The first time was a crack in our marriage. Like a crack in a teacup that you could still use with some glue, although damaged. The second DD time, though shattered me. It really did and trying to fix that (like a shattered teacup) may or may not be impossible. If it is possible, it will take a long time and some painstaking effort. Two years later we are still trying to find the right pieces. If I am happy and if I find out I am wrong about my H’s worthiness, I realistically fear I will have a breakdown. I don’t believe I am strong enough to do this again mentally and i can’t have a nervous breakdown, I NEED to be here for my kids.

      • Strengthrequired

        Tired, that is what I fear, breaking and not being able to be repaired. I also fear that I would end up hating my h, and I don’t want to be that way for my kids sake. They need us, both of us, and they need us together. I see them happy, and I feel relief.
        My h told me one day, after I mentioned to him, I was not sure if we should stay together, his response was ” you want to break our family, that is so selfish”. Yet he forgets, just how selfish he was, and who was actually fighting for our marriage while he kept his affair going, time and time again, several ddays, to be honest lost count how many ddays.

        • Blue

          This resonates with me. The only way our children can stay well adjusted through a divorce is if the parents are amicable. The parents are the two people in the world they love the most. To see the two people they love the most hate each other must be truly heartbreaking.

          If my H cheats again, I would hope to feel sorry for him- that he is such a loser that he doesn’t deserve hate- just pity.

          • Strengthrequired

            Blue, I told my h during his fantasy, that I will db there for him no matter what. I still would be his friend, and of course I would still love him, but he would be the one that has to live with his choice.
            I really didn’t want to lose him as a friend, after all he is the father of my children. I always feared though if he couldn’t stop his affair, while still declaring he wanted me and our family, that I would stop feeling sorry for him and start feeling anger and hate towards him, I didn’t want to turn into that person, not when I have loved him so long.

    • Jim

      I was asked my wife the other day what her emotional affair partner was giving her that I wasn’t? She gave me an answer close to something I read I read in another blog that a former WS answered…” I wanted him only because of the way he made me feel about myself” Have others experienced this answer?

    • Jim

      Jim cont…my apologies for not proofing my prior post. Sent it before it was fully edited..

      • Strengthrequired

        Him, I haven’t had that response, but i know that would have been something my h felt at the beginning of his ea/pa, why else go into an affair in the first place if not to make yourself feel better about yourself. It took a while for him to see that she wasn’t making him feel better, she was making him feel worse.

        • Blue

          The ego rubbing!! It makes people lose their senses. My husband’s ego was getting so swollen I didn’t recognize him. I wish I had a video of what he acted like and said during that time. He still likes his ego rubbed, and I try. I think he’s an ego addict though.

          • Jim

            Thanks Blue!!….I think that has a lot to do with it…when arguing over the affair a number of times she turns the tables, blames me for kicking her to the curb emotionally throughout our 20 yrs together and telling me that she is fabulous and has a lot to offer someone… Wonder where that came from?? Obviously the AP is feeding her tons of compliments and boosting her ego and telling her what jerk I am….she swears they don’t discuss me at all… When she tells me she has a lot to offer I don’t argue that she doesn’t because she is..(was a least till the affair) a truely wonderful person but it catches me in a trap. I tell her yes you are fabulous but you shouldn’t be doing inappropriate things outside our marriage, she says” well you should of thought about for the last 20 yrs, now you have pushed me in to where we are today…. It’s a horrible cyle that gets played over and over….soooo frustrating….

            • Kimpage

              Yes it can be a vicious cycle but you need to get out of it. Both of you MAY have contributed to the environment in your relationship that left the door open for cheating but SHE chose this inappropriate behavior, NOT YOU. This is not your fault. Cheaters always try to blame others at first but eventually the truth is revealed about their lack of committment and morals. Of course it is easier for her to blame you; that way she can lie to you and herself and try to justify her awful behavior and not admit the guilt she is most certainly feeling. Don’t buy into this!!!

    • tryinghard

      Jim

      You’ve gotten some great advice. I know you are in a hyper state of confusion where conversations is at times surreal.

      Kimpage hit the nail pretty succinctly on the head. DO NOT let her obfuscate the affair problem with the other problems in your relationship. It’s her defense mechanism and they all use it. Mine was I played Words with Friends 🙂 Step back and stay logical and to the point. You first have to get through the issue of the affair before you can move forward and deal with marital problems. You have to fry one small fish at a time as well as carry on with the other petty details of your life like work and family.

      You may have to pull out the big guns and yes issue an ultimatum. Some call it setting boundaries. I don’t care what it’s called however I do know if you keep allowing her to treat you like crap, she will. And you should point out just what Kimpage said. She has chosen to betray her commitment to you and a moral standard.

      You said she’s a good catch or something to that affect. She may be beautiful, fit, smart, good mother but if she is lying and cheating she is most definitely NOT a good catch right now.

      Time to sh*$@! or get off the pot sister!!! She cannot go on having it both ways unless you allow it!

      • Strengthrequired

        Th, that’s the thing, as a bs we take on all the responsibilities more than ever before, we pick up the slack for them the cs, and we feel we have to because we are trying to save our marriages, our family, our cs from the terrible mistakes they are making as well as taking on all the blame for why they cheated, why they betrayed our marital vows. We take the load off of them and take on the belief that we caused the affair, and we must fix our wrong. Unfortunately it isn’t until you find a place like here that you get to realise none of this was your fault, that it was the cs who did wrong. That’s when things start becoming clearer, and the way they lie, omit, and get defensive more than ever, because all their short comings, all of their guilt start showing itself.
        Of course we see the good in our cs, we know them and have known them for a long time, then they fall, but they don’t fall by themselves, they take us and their children with them, but we still try and protect them, yes we see how strange and crazy they have become, but we see, they didn’t get to that point on their own, well most of them, they had someone else helping the cs drag us down, someone else trying to prove to the cs that they are worth destroying a family for, they are so much better than their spouse, they have used information the cs has given them and keep using it to their benefit, even though it’s made up by the cs, so they don’t feel as bad. Yes we all may have had some sort of issue, in the marriage but who doesn’t, most of our issues, were trivial at best, and most certainly didn’t cause the cs to lose their way, they could have easily been worked on, it was the weakness of the cs, that caused the mess. We as usual just keep picking up the pieces, until they are strong enough to see for themselves, or are forced to see it.
        Who knows where I’m going with this, I’m half asleep lol.

        • tabs

          SR,

          I agree with what you wrote. I’ve been trying my best to get over the cheating. But, like you and many other, we seem to sabatoge our happiness. I clearly remember the pain and agony of Dday and the months/years that followed. Now, three years after Dday, I still have to refrain my need to constantly remind my CS of the consequences of his actions.There isn’t a day gone by where I wonder if I should have pushed my CS out the door and never looked back. However, this marriage I’m in now, is completely different from the one before Dday. Perhaps it’s best to say, this is a totally new relationship and marriage. The pain of losing what I had still resurfaces, and I can never live that fairy tale again. I just have to start anew with unfiltered eyes.

          • Strengthrequired

            Tabs almost three here since dday, and it’s hard getting used to losing my old marriage and beliefs of what I thought my marriage was and the person my h was. Now a new relationship is here, and hopefully a better one can come of this mess, but I don’t think without setbacks getting there. I think just getting used to the new way we see things.
            It’s funny but in many ways I see this whole ordeal has affected both my h and myself in very similar ways, he nolonger trusts anyone and gets very straight forward with people now more than ever before and it doesn’t take much. I’m the same.

      • Jim

        Thanks Kim & TH,
        I appreciate your thoughts and words….I have threatened leaving and she chases me down like a scared schoolgirl crying she can’t imagine her life without me and she says we will never divorce with our 13 year old at home. My wife parents divorced when she was in her late teens and has very little contact with her biological father. A huge amount of abandonment buried inside her that she never really came to terms with….. There are many issues she is dealing with besides her emotional infidelity. Seeing a therapist a few times a week shows me she is starting to deal with all of it….

    • tryinghard

      Jim

      Seriously? Past issues, my Daddy didn’t love me, childhood issues blah, blah, blah,blah!!!!. Who the hell doesn’t have those?? We all have those issues!

      Quit. making. excuses. for. her.

      She is having a relationship with another man while she is married to YOU. She needs to quit doing that. You need to tell her if she wants to continue living with you and having you pay her bills, She can’t do that.

      You are wasting valuable time by making excuses and covering up and not facing the facts. Stop it. Get smart. Quit being a doormat.

      Are you certain she’s seeing a therapist 3x a week?? That’s an awful lot of therapy. You may want to see those bills. Sorry but I call Bullshit on that! Hope I’m wrong but if she is that fucked up she needs therapy 3x a week maybe she’s not such a great catch after all the best thing you could do for you and your 13 year old son is get the hell away from her!

      • Strengthrequired

        Th, am I wrong at thinking this but i would gave thought once a week would be what is started with when seeing a therapist. Definately think three times is a lot.

        • tryinghard

          No SR you are not wrong. I’ve been to 1 marriage counselor, 2 psychologists and 1 psychiatrist!!! So I guess you could say I was pretty effed up and even I only went once a week! Seriously I was homicidal and suicidal (not really LOL but pretty damn close) and NONE thought they should see me/us more than once a week. After a few weeks it was once every 2-3 weeks, then once a month for 6 month? maybe.

          I think this chick is in a deep fog and lying her butt off. But what do I know, I’m crazy?!?!? 🙂

          • Strengthrequired

            That’s what I thought, exactly. After a month or so they start extending time between each appointment.
            I would be checking.

    • Tryinghard

      Tabs and SR.

      My h and I renewed our vows in 2012 in the church my parents were married in Paris in 1945. It was very special and all his idea. I tear up thinking about it and actually means more to me than my original anniversary.

      The priest at that ceremony said you shouldn’t put new wine in old skins. Also saying that after 35 years of marriage there’s a lot to let go of and forgive. She was right.

      Yes we do need to let go, let it be and move on at some point. One way or another.

    • Kimpage

      Congratulations! Your “2nd marraige” sounds wonderful. April 10th was my dday August 14th was my 32nd anniversary. August 14th I gave him back my rings and told him they didn’t mean anything anymore because he broke the vows. He told me then that if I could ever forgive him he would marry me all over again and we would have new rings and a new date to celebrate. We have worked hard and are better now than ever before. I forgave him last weekend. He says he may never forgive himself. I am happier now and working now to help him find the good from all this pain and loss. I am hoping for a winter wedding in NYC!!! So happy for you.

    • Tryinghard

      Kimpage

      He actually suggested it in 2011 when the whole discovery began We went through MC and lots of talking. It was a goal for us. I didn’t think we’d sctually do it but finally sept 2012 came and we got on the plane to paris. Well I’d go to Paris with the devil himself so I thought he pisses me off not only w I’ll i not do the marriage ceremony I’ll lose his ass in the middle of Paris and I’ll just stay

    • Kimpage

      Tryinghard. Lol.

    • tabs

      Trying & Kim

      I admire you’re strength. My H wanted to renew our vows. But, I just couldn’t do it again. If he couldn’t keep the promise the first time, why bother the second time around. Plus, my mom was sick. I just couldn’t concentrate on renewing my vows and a dying mother. I did, however, get a new wedding ring and a trip to Australia.

      • Strengthrequired

        Th, I remember you mentioning it a while ago, I am really happy that you have a new wonderful memory.

        Kimpage, I’m happy for you too, it’s great that your h wanted to give you a special new day to remember.

        Tabs, my h gave me a new ring too, not a vow renewal, although I have asked for one, not sure I will get it though. Lol.

        Th, your right as well, there comes a point where we just have to let it go, and take that leap of faith and move forward. I certainly don’t want to be stuck in this for ever, I’m sure the ow would love to know what an impact she made to my life, and would probably celebrate knowing that she caused a lot of damage, so the best way to get back at her is to enjoy life and let her see us happy and inlove and able to forgive past errors of judgement. What better way to show roadwhores that they were just a bump in the road, a road hump…. That meant nothing.

    • Jim

      Thanks for all the great feedback and advice!! Points well taken!!! I am leaning toward a firmer stance… I do feel i need to enlighten you on my shortcomings and history first before we all execute my wife. She has a ton of resentment toward me for all the shit I did for a long time. I didn’t treat her well for 7 yrs of dating, she was a big girl and I was not in to her like I should of been. Told my family I would never marry her and I wanted to get out of the relationship, gave her every opportunity to leave, she never did. We had fun and she has a personality like no other but I was not a loving caring boyfriend…..I’m pretty irresponsible and I let her take care of everything, all the admin stuff it takes to run a life, I made good money but she had to do it all, and still does for the most part…… She bought an engagement ring and gave to me to give to her. ( she told me the pain see saw in my eyes the day we got engaged haunts her to this day) and she was right, I was not ready to commit after 7 yrs…… but we bought a house had a beautiful daughter and I was a different man, I was finally in love, she had lost all her extra weight and we had great life…but life took over and we grew apart, sex went totally away ( we have only had sex 7-8 times in the last 10 yrs) yep, that’s it…..we had terrible fights, we managed to have lots of fun, but it was a horrible broken marriage… Well before the affair she begged me to be a man and take care of her and make her feel safe, but I never really stepped up to the plate. She stopped the sex and I basically kicked her to the curb emotionally…no sex so i gave no spousal support….then in Jan of this year I told her a bold face lie that I had made a bank deposit earlier that day, I came home, she said the acct still didn’t show it, I went ballistic, called her names, drove to the office to find the deposit slip only to return with nothing, she knew i was lying… It was my worst moment as a husband and father, sooo weak… The next day she took off her rings and by mid Feb, I could tell something was up….DDay. She had checked out of our marriage and started an emotional affair… Hasnt put rings on since….Since that time I have done a 180 in my life, I finally saw the light, but she is slowing moving back toward me, hasn’t ended her affair but I am all in as an attentive husband…./she just can’t get past how I treated her for 20 years she desperately wants to feel safe and cared for but just can’t get past the past history… So there you have it. I’m no Prince Charming but I never cheated and she chose to…..

    • Jim

      Jim cont…. She says she would wear her rings but when she looks down on them all sees is sadness and hurt…. Im glad she is going to therapy often, hopefully she is working through her all her pain….

      • Strengthrequired

        Jim, do you think now you can really love her? Do you think you can make her happy now and mean it? If you do then you need to show her and keep showing her.
        Maybe tell her you would like to renew your vows, and buy her that new ring, and give her new memories to cherish, for you both to cherish.
        People make mistakes, it is what we do to correct the mistakes that makes us who we are.

        • Jim

          Thanks SR!!!……I can and will love her, I’m dying inside, it’s really affecting my job performance, I stare at walls and read blogs too much. Still cant believe she is doing this. She lost hope in us that day I lied. Says her life flashed before her eyes….I regret it horribly. Such a weak cowardly thing to do. She keeps saying she,prays she can find her way back to me…. We will see…I need to find my mojo and be a man, she’s begging for me to find my old self the sporty fun loving guy she fell in love with. Her words…..She told me that today,

          • Strengthrequired

            Jim, if you love her and can always until the end of days, then I say show her. Show her what she means to you, what your family means to you. By the sounds of it, she is scared of believing. Your job us to prove it. You have something more powerful on your side, that the om doesn’t. A history, a child together, you are a family.
            I know how you feel, and all of us here do as well, we know that pain, ohhh so well.

            • Strengthrequired

              Ohh and jim, you know her as well. You have shared a life time with each other.

    • Gizfield

      Jim, it sounds like you think that your wife having an affair is a “reward” for her to make up for your real or imagined previous bad behavior. It’s not. It needs to stop and it certainly won’t as long as you take responsibility for it. I don’t understand what you lying about a bank deposit has to do with her dating someone else. Just excuses for her own bad behavior. Bringing other people into your marriage under any circumstances will never make anything better. You are being gaslighted.

    • Tryinghard

      Jim

      Marriages can be tough and it sounds like both of you have contributed to leaving the door open for an affair. People make miserable choices when there are problems and she or even you could have turned to some other equally miserable choice to deal with your pains. None of those choice last to easy the pain and just compound the problems. It’s too bad you two couldn’t try to sove those problems without going outside the marriage to find those solutions.

      If you two want to heal your marriage you have to deal with one problem at a time and if she wants to do that she needs to quit having an affair for starters.

      No you do not sound like a Prince Charming. But if she were so miserable in her marriage divorce first. You don’t start one relationship while in the middle of another. Not smart, not right, not healthy, not moral on many levels.

    • Jim

      Thanks guys appreciate all your thoughts and advice. Thought a little history be told would make our situation a little clearer….after spilling my guts you all have given me the strength to see that as bad as we let our marriage go the gutter it is still worth saving and it still horribly wrong on her end to leave our marriage to find emotional support from another man… She says she has told him that she is married and that he can’t have her and that he doesn’t pressure her to move on, but I find that hard to believe. When your spouses were involved did their affair partners push them for a commitment or future together???

    • Kimpage

      No. My husband says he always told her he was not leaving his wife and just wanted sex and that she only wanted sex too!

    • Redemption

      Jim: My experience was the opposite of Kimpage’s. My husband told me his A/P “expected” certain things, 1) like being told she was loved and 2) that he led her to “believe” she would have some sort of future with him. But like most anything back in those days he didn’t bother with the little details such as what that would look like for her or much less me. In other words he led her on just enough without giving her any real commitment. Everything he said and did was to further his own “feel good” agenda. It didn’t matter who he hurt in the process. He did tell me he considered leaving me (but never did). I can only assume that he told her what he felt she wanted to hear, so he could continue his feel good fantasy and have sex whenever he chose to visit. The constant theme being that if they feel they can get away with it, they continue their affair actions. Along with their thinking “what you don’t know won’t hurt you” and they “want their cake and eat it too” syndrome.

      • Jim

        Interesting Redemption. Thanks for the reply. Knowing my wife and figuring out that what she craves and gets from this guy is the way he makes her feel about herself…. I’m assuming she is leading him on just to get that ego fix that’s she so desperately seems to need….from everything I have found out by badgering her he last 10 months and have read I truly believe it is only an an EA… She tried no contact in July but went immediately back to seeing him once he returned to town 2 weeks ago….I just want it to end…..how long before this fog lifts???? Going with a tougher stance, drawing a line in the sand soon

      • Strengthrequired

        Redemption- that is what my h did. He wanted to be a hero, although telling me and others he wanted to leave me, he didn’t really want to. He told the ow what she wanted to hear, let her plan in her mind a future with him, so he too could have his cake and eat it too.
        Jim, yes, the ow in my h life pressured him continuously to leave me and our children. Every week or so there was something new, a new way for her to try and get my h and I to part ways. I’m not sure if I was stupid or strong in not just letting her have her way. Yet I see my children now and they have both of us together (for now) and they are happy. My children’s lives are starting to settle down, not so chaotic, and that is what they deserve. They do not need some skanky ass ow who didn’t care about them or their family trying to act like a replacement mummy to them.
        Your wife has to let go of the om, she has to decide what is more important, you and your child or the om.

      • Jim

        Thanks SR, as I mentioned before she consistently says she would never leave me for someone else, those relationships never work out blah blah blah… But she also likes to keep her foot in door by also saying ” if there is something you need to know I will come to you with it”….what the hell does that mean? other than to say, I’m going to continue to see this guy and keep it going, and who knows I may end up with him…., .She just needs that ego stroke… They just can’t see or feel the damage they are doing…

        • Strengthrequired

          Jim, that’s why it is so hard, they only see what they want to see, because to open their eyes and see the destruction they have caused and continue to cause, takes away the ego stroking and they are faced with the person they never knew or realised existed within them, someone that is capable of hurting those they love the most.
          No one wants to see the ugly truth staring back at them. Hiding in their own little fantasy land is far more intriguing and fun, they get to feel good about themselves, they get to have someone else show them how wonderful they are and how special they are, they get to see the ap as something special , and don’t get to see the real person, it’s when they do decide to face the real world does the truth begin to show.

          • Jim

            Vicious heart wrenching cycle that continues to turn until they see the light…and when does the light come on??? That’s why everyone is here… Wanting to know ….. You have been very helpful!!!

    • tryinghard

      Jim

      The light comes on when YOU turn it on. You may not believe it, but the ball is in YOUR court, not hers.

      You said yourself that every time you put your foot down on this affair she comes running back. Well that is the light my friend, only YOU have to leave it on.

      Don’t buy into her excuses and gaslighting. I’m not talking about any other problems regarding you marital relationship, IMO you need much more professional help than what I could possibly say, I’m talking about her continuing the affair.

    • tryinghard

      And BTW Jim I think you KNOW what needs to be done. You just need to put your big boy pants on and do it.

      I’m sorry if I sound harsh, but this is war my friend.

    • Jim

      I hear ya TH. I have screamed divorce, told her who my attorney was ( I have talked to him) told her I was moving on… I have laid it down a number of times. i have yelled ” end it now or i am gone” so many times……Any suggestion on what/how to do it? Lock the doors and put her shit in the garage?

      • tryinghard

        Yes, now you quit yelling, quit talking, and carry on with what you say. Say what you mean and mean what you say. It is impossible to move forward with any kind of reconciliation UNTIL she ends the affair.

        NO do not change the locks. Do NOT throw her stuff in garage. It’s her house too. Do this and she can have YOU thrown out. She still gets to live there but you can move to a different room in the house and put a lock on the door. Get some good legal advice.

        But yes, she either stops the affair TODAY or you proceed with divorce!

        No screaming, no yelling, no fighting. She’s calling your bluff because you yell and scream and then don’t carry out any of your demands on her to stop the affair. The strokes she is getting from her lover is worth it in her mind.

        Speak softly and find a good lawyer!

    • Strengthrequired

      Does anyone know how to detach themselves from certain situations so it doesn’t affect you so much? Had a argument with my h yesterday in relation to his family. We spend more and more time with them, and now his father is here. So what I need is to know how to be around these people, so my h can enjoy his time with them, so he can talk about them and me not feel so upset. So much has happened over the years that I find I am angry and hurt as well as very untrusting, and my h doesn’t understand it.
      So now I need to have no emotions when it comes to them, and I’m not sure how.

      • tabs

        SR-

        I am right behind you looking for an answer, too. I ususally percolate and wonder why I didn’t just get a divorce. Out of curiosity, is the family a trigger?

        • Strengthrequired

          Tabs, his family have wanted me away from my h ever since we were dating. So it has been over 20 years of someone in his family trying to break us, the last almost did, the affair pushed on him by family. Now I don’t trust any of them, yet now I have to associate with them and I need to try and not take it out on my h.

          • Jim

            SR, Inlaws and siblings can easily come between you and your spouse. In the recovery process I would put my blinders on and keep your emotions in check and think about what your ultimate goal is…keeping your family together. If triggers set you off and put you in a bad place remove yourself from the room. I would suggest starting MC. Your husband needs to recognize and feel your pain. Does he not see how bad they treat you?

            • Strengthrequired

              Thanks jim, I am trying really hard to out those blinders on.

    • Jim

      Or you could bite your tounge and kill all of them with kindness and see how that works….from the sounds of it, they treat you horribly, so it would take a tremendous amount of courage and strenght to pull that off and maintain it for an extended period of time….I am sorry you have to deal with those dynamics on top of trying to recover from your husbands infidelity…

      • Strengthrequired

        Jim, my h parents seemed quite different to what I am used to, his father actually greeted me with a sincere hello, and how are you, are you ok and well. Yes may have been the only conversation we had, but it was sincere this time. Not what I am used to at all. Yet maybe he sees how difficult I am to get rid of after two decades and six kids later. Even though other relatives of his have tried even with my six kids.
        I would like to let my guard down, but I can’t. Too much has happened over the years from my fil, to my bil family, to aunties and cousins of my h and even some of my h friends, have all tried to get me out of my h life, all because I wasn’t one of them.
        Now I just see myself as tired, and at times done, worn out.

    • tryinghard

      SR

      I stay away or if I have to be with them I keep the conversation very superficial. I don’t respond to their criticisms. I pretend I don’t hear them. I do not look them in the eye. I greet very friendly and then sit and listen.

      Keep the conversations focused around things like how darling your children are, the weather, etc. Walk out of the room whenever you can. But most of all have a signal to your husband when it is time to leave!

      Are you going to their homes or are they coming to yours?

      • Strengthrequired

        Th, I am always pleasant with them, but I’m not so understanding of them anymore, yet I had grown up to respect my elders and I continue to do so. I guess that’s why my h cops it. Lol
        We visited them, my fil was different to what I am used to, he was nicer, yet we only said a few words, that was enough. He met his grandchildren for the first time, and showed them kindness, which at least they get to see each other, because he won’t be around forever. I wouldn’t like to have that held over my head as well.

        • Strengthrequired

          Ohh and th, I tried hard to detach myself from a bit last night, just kept placing my mind onto something else, especially when I could see my self getting annoyed or frustrated.
          After the argument with my h the other day, I realised that I need to step back, and he needs to step forward. The problem is my h likes to be the centre of attention, you always have to make sure he feels good, if you don’t, you don’t appreciate him. I’m sick and tired of it.
          Last night, at one point he said, ” ohhh I’m hot, then makes a big deal of being hot, the door was opened for him, I told him go sit near the door. Get some fresh air, then he says again, ohh I’m hot, ohhhh I’m hot, then goes to walk outside, for a second then sits back down. I said to him, yes we get it your hot, how many times do we have to hear it?

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