It’s time to discuss what’s going on and share your struggles – and your successes.

 

By Linda & Doug

It’s been a while since our last Open Mic.  So, let’s do it!

In case you didn’t know, or are new to our site, the Open Mic discussion is where you guys call the shots and discuss the topics that you want to discuss.

We know there must be some things that are going on that you can either ask questions about, share your experiences – or maybe just do a little venting.  (Especially with the holidays fast approaching.)

We appreciate it as it not only helps to share and get the input from others, but it also helps us with possible issues to address in future posts.  Thanks!

With that said, the floor is all yours!

Feel free to discuss anything…

  • What’s on your mind?
  • What are you struggling with?
  • What are your thoughts on dealing with your situation as we head into the holiday season?
  • Have any success stories to share? Big or small. (We especially want to hear some of these!)
  • Wanna share any lessons you’ve learned recently?
  • Got a question? Ask it.
  • Do you have any problems or situations that you’d like the community to offer their opinions on?
  • Any good books you’d like to discuss?
  • What’s your favorite movie of all time?
  • What are you and/or your spouse doing to further the healing and recovery in your relationship?
  • What’s working or not working?
  • Has your therapist given you any good advice or exercises that the rest of the readers might benefit from?
  • What has your spouse done lately that really pisses you off?
  • What has your spouse done lately to make you really happy?
  • Tell us a little about yourself.
  • Everything and anything is on the table for discussion!

Please don’t be shy. If there is anything whatsoever on your mind, please leave a comment below.  And please reply to each other in the comments, as each person leaving a comment is not an isolated incident.

Thanks!

Linda & Doug

 

 

 

    39 replies to "Open “Mic” #44 – What’s On Your Mind?"

    • michele

      Husband was in a two year secret affair and after d day exposure he has been living openly with affair partner for 2yrs 4mo. I still have hope that he will wake up and this relationship will falter. It is getting harder as time marches on. He was very hurtful to me in the beginning telling me things about him and affair partner like I was a friend who wouldn’t be crushed by the talk. I will say that has gone away and he never talks of her to me and treats me much kinder and actually showed some support and empathy when our beloved cat died recently. I am moving on, but still hold hope. Does one of those actions(moving on) delete the other(holding hope)? Has anyone stood this long or longer and had a good outcome?

      • lisa

        Michele, So sorry that you are going through this. It isn’t easy! I’m only 4 1/2 mo. in and only 2 1/2 mo. in knowing the full truth. You didn’t indicate if the two of you had divorced. Your husband has been in the relationship 4 plus years? Is that correct? You obviously still love him deeply and those feelings are not being reciprocated. Is he indicating that he wants to return to you? I will pray that your heart will be freed!

        • Michele

          Hi Lisa, I’m sorry you are going through this as well. I remember my first months and it was something I never want to experience again. To answer your question we are not divorced. I will never file. He brought it up 3 different times in the beginning as the affair partner was pressuring him. My H was never one to be pressured so its interesting that he has managed to find that part of him and thus I hope he continues to find himself and leave the affair partner. I am moving on in a sense, but always hold hope in the back of my mind. Statistics of them having a lasting relationship just aren’t on the cheaters side, yet I know people vary from the norms all the time and my husband already showed that by being in the 25% of those caught who don’t take the forgiveness offered and continue with the affair. Thank you for your prayer that my heart will be freed. I pray for your situation as well. It’s all we have as I believe it will take Devine power to make changes.

    • Kittypone

      My issue is that after almost 5 years of DDAY, my love for my h effectively cooled down enough to be on life support…..I genuinely don’t care much for anything much about him and feel little to no affection towards him….intimacy is down to next to nothing, and I just don’t care if we get it back or not…..right after DDay I was so desperate to win him back, to be the wife he always wanted, to try and tone down my personality to please him, to be more soft spoken, patient, loving, etc. etc. etc……while all along he didn’t do much of anything to try to repair the damage to my emotions, to my mental health, to my heart and soul….he just expected that time
      Would heal everything and he wouldn’t have to do much himself….not work towards anything that would help to heal ME…….well, I just stopped caring and couldn’t give two s***s if he suddenly got on his knee and begged me for a second chance……any advice out there?

    • Linc

      I found out my wife of 17 years had at least two affairs over the last few years and the last one I found out while she was in it. I asked her to end it and she got a burner phone to talk and I caught them secretly meeting multiple times. She said they are just friends and she has never admitted to any of the affairs. It’s been 4 months since DDay at it looks like 3 months since she ended it (if I can trust she is telling the truth). But if she will never admit to it even with evidence how can we possibly move in and stay together? I am rushing to make a decision but I feel I have to leave after the holidays because there is no honesty.

      • Over it

        Hi Linc,

        Leave. You deserve 100% transparency and honesty. If you don’t make it clear that you mean business, she will continue her sneaking around. Don’t trust a word she says. Cheaters are liars.

    • Connie

      My concerns are all lost on my husband. He promises to do all kinds of things to help us heal, but then does absolutely nothing unless I initiate it( usually after getting so frustrated I end up going bat crap crazy and start yelling, which ends in another argument). He claims he wants to put us, our marriage, our future as his number one priority, but doesn’t know how to do that, claims he needs some professional help, but doesn’t seek it, claims we will move from this house, since he brought his affair partner into it, and I’m struggling dealing with the ghost of his affair partner(especially after he called me her name while we were making love), but makes no effort to call real estate agents in searching for a new home. He keeps telling me healing takes time. I agree it does, but I also reminded him that healing also means putting in the hard work to heal. and that I’ve been going to counseling, I’ve been looking for a new home, I’ve been seeking spiritual help . I also am feeling less and less loving feelings for my husband, He keeps telling me that even though I have forgiven him, he’s not really sure he can believe me, because I still feel we need to discuss everything and if I truly forgave I should be able to just move on. Forgiving is not forgetting and pretending it didn’t happen. This usually starts another argument and then for a couple of days things are okay, but they it’s back to the same old- just doing nothing, but thinking about everything he needs to do to make our life better and heal the hurt so we can move on. Any suggestions on how to motivate him? or is it time to move on by myself?

    • Ang

      My H had a two year love affair. It has been two years since Dday. He came to a few marriage counseling sessions, he has changed into a nicer and more caring person, and he is no longer involved with his AP. However, there is constant turmoil inside of me. He called his affair partner “beautiful” and “baby girl”, but he only calls me by my name. He went out to dates with her and talked to her for hours, but none of that is happening with us. I don’t want to leave, however, I don’t feel that he will ever be able to love me the way he loved her. I wonder whether leaving him will allow me to get rid off this suffocating feeling that “his heart will secretly love her”. I know that one will argue that if he loved her he would not have stayed with you, but I know that a minor part of his decision to stay with me was his reputation , kids and financial safety. Deep in my heart I know that if none of the above were a factor, I would not be his choice.

      • Kittypone

        Ang; I totally relate to you. I am almost 5 years from DDay and even tho he “chose” me, I know that if she hadn’t ended it, he would’ve taken the risk and kept the relationship going. 2 things against him was that she is married and lives in another country, so they never got to take it to the physical per se, but did plenty of dirty pics and video chats, so the full intent was there. All this to say, that even tho he stayed, I put all the work. To this day, he has never truly repented and apologized to me for his actions, and he has never shown me more affection or any kind of emotional connection to me, so whatever love I still felt for him has slowly leaked out so today I feel basically nothing for my husband. I haven’t left him because I feel that I would have to feel complete and absolute detachment from him to take that step, and I haven’t gotten there yet, but his lack of affection is slowly but surely taking me there. Do what is best for you and your family and I wish you much luck whatever the outcome.

    • Lisa E

      I am only 4 1/2 mo. into DDay and 2 1/2 mo. into the “full” truth being revealed. My husband has been a gem in talking (even when I see he hates the questions), going to counseling, and doing the right things. He even surprised me with a special trip out of town during the Thanksgiving holiday(s).
      I am grateful for the care he is giving in building “us” back, but I still have nightmares, questions, tears. . . is this normal? My pain is still very raw. . . is it normal when a husband is doing so much to assure his love and commitment and me, as the betrayed still feels that betrayal?

      • Linc

        Hi Lisa, I am on the same time frame you are. 4 months in and it doesn’t seem to be getting any better. My wife won’t admit to anything so that is probably making it tougher but I don’t see how to move on. I wake up and think about it then trouble falling back asleep. And I struggle to function half the day. I hope it gets better but without the honesty I need I think I have to leave after the holidays.

    • Torture Test

      Lisa-
      I hate that you are in the thick of it. 75 days in … I was a train wreck – a walking, talking exposed nerve. I had discovered pain and emotions that I didn’t even know existed. The fact that your CS has moved through the “head up their own ars” phase more quickly than most is a positive indicator, but it doesn’t change the nature of his transgression. You still have to grieve, mourn, rage, reflect and ultimately decide if you are able to forgive and are willing to reconcile to rebuild your shattered partnership with the person your spouse has revealed themselves to be.

      Short answer … absolutely normal to feel the way that you do and you have every right to feel everything that you feel. And just because he is acting the part of the model WS, there is no time limit or schedule for your recovery. It takes as long as it takes – and if he continues to support you through your process – all he gets is “golf clap” … maybe an “atta boy”. Don’t throw him a parade just because he’s acting like a decent human being now. I do recommend showing appreciation for his efforts – but don’t be surprised if those words of encouragement taste like vinegar coming out or if 30 minutes later your mood has shifted and you come back and tear him a new one.

      Best of luck. I can’t speak to your experience, but ~340 days in and things are just starting to turn for me (if you ask me tomorrow, I might just say the opposite ). Don’t be surprised if things get worse before they get better – and don’t you dare blame yourself if they do. You didn’t ask to be dropped into this torture test. And no one can tell you the “right way” to get to the other side – I’m pretty convinced there is no “right way”.

      But there is nothing I won’t do for my girls and I still love my wife – even the broken, unmasked version I now find myself married to – so I continue to endure, continue to persevere.

      • Shifting Impressions

        Torture Test And Lisa
        Exactly….I couldn’t agree more. I think the grieving after discovering an affair is often downplayed. Let’s just quickly move on to forgiveness and “fixing” the marriage…..because after all there must have been something wrong with the BS and the marriage to “cause” someone to cheat. And let’s just add another layer of guilt when “trust” is not immediately restored. That type of thinking not only doesn’t make sense but I believe it’s extremely harmful.

        Lisa, Torture Test has given you some really good advice. Give yourself permission to grieve…..no matter how long it takes. Don’t stuff down the pain just because it makes the CS uncomfortable or yourself uncomfortable for that matter.. There are no shortcuts in dealing with the aftermath of betrayal. It’s often one step forward and two steps back.

    • Scott

      I found out that my wife was having an emotional affair with some 19 year old online states away. I found this out last November. I eventually gave her the ultimatum of choosing us or him and she would constantly avoid it. She eventually “chose us” and she then acted completely cold to me for another 4 months while I tried again and again to show her that we can make it through this and build us back. She would tell me that she doesn’t think she can love me like she did ever again. She told me one morning that she thinks she’s done with us now and I told her that it’s sad to see her give all of this up without even trying to fix things. She eventually went to stay with her coworker to work on herself and think on things. I was understanding of that and let her take that time. She stayed there for six months and during that time it seemed like things were finally breaking through to her. She was showing me love and care and affection like she had before. I could feel her love again finally and not just straight coldness. But she would continue to keep telling me she was going to come home and give me times that she will and never committed to those time frames. Then, at the beginning of November, I find out that she hasn’t been staying at her coworker’s place for about that entire time. She was only over there for about a month and she told her coworker that she went home while also telling me that she was still over there. It turns out my wife had been living in a hotel with the guy she was talking to before. Their emotional affair turned into physical as well. He moved here to live with her. A couple days later after I found that out, I gave her another chance to be open and honest to me and told her that we can move through this together. She begged me to give her another chance and showed a ton of remorse. So I gave her that opportunity to work through this. It seemed like things were starting to get a little better and she moved back in with me after she grabbed her things from the hotel. Then last week I get a knock on the door and it was the AP. He was lied to as well and my CS told him that she went back to her coworker’s again to “think” when she was at home with me. He told me that my CS was still talking to him and that they both actually slept with each other a couple nights ago. I was devastated because I really did give her that chance again. I told my CS that I’m done with her and I am so tired of being put through all of this pain from her and I told her to leave. She left with the AP and was hysterically crying. I couldn’t even look at her because I was so disappointed and honestly disgusted by what she had done. She told me that she loved me so much as she was walking out the door but I just kept silent. I only told her goodbye.

      It’s been a week now and I haven’t talked to her at all. That’s been so difficult because I just want to sit and talk to her. But I have tried that so many times before and it didn’t help anything because she was still doing the same things. I still feel like there is hope in all of this if she could just wake up and realize everything wrong. I feel like I’m clinging onto that hope so tightly and I’m lost on what to do. I don’t want to lose her and our relationship. I love her so dearly and I know that she loves me still. But she just doesn’t want to give up one or the other and commit to something. I feel so lost and just absolutely destroyed. Does anyone have any advice out there..?

      • Linc

        Scott,

        That sounds brutal. I don’t really have any good advice. I understand you love her and want to stay with her but it doesn’t sound like she respects your marriage at all. The fact that she was lying the whole time and living with him is all I have to see. I am going through something a little different and I am still with my wife but in the same way catching her in lies after DDay has shown me she has no respect for me or our marriage or our family. At some point you have to just walk away. You deserve better. We all deserve better. It’s been 4 months and I am still struggling to function on a daily basis. I hate the way I feel and I just want the feeling to go away. I don’t know how it can when there is no respect or trust.

        So sorry I don’t have any really good advice. But know you deserve better then this. And there are other people out there dealing with similar issues and we are hear for you. These boards have given me some way to post how I feel and see I am not alone.

        • Scott

          Thank you for your response Linc. I’m sorry you are going through this too. These boards have helped me as well and let’s me know that people have very similar stories.

          I know I do deserve better and I don’t deserve to be treated this way. But I keep holding on to hope because I know that she does love me and I love her more than anything. I feel so stuck. I haven’t talked to her at all since last week. She went back with the AP and I’m assuming is staying with him. I want to contact her and ask if we can meet up to talk a bit but is that even a good idea..? I know that she is still in the affair fog and she’s so blind to the destruction she is causing. I keep hoping that the fog will lift for her and she will see how much she is throwing away. I am proud of myself for putting my foot down with telling her to leave because she couldn’t make the decision between him or me. I know that I am so tired of feeling the pain she keeps putting me through with all of the lies, but I know she isn’t a bad person. I’ve never thought she was a bad person even through all of this. What she has done is bad, but I know it’s not who she is. Maybe I’m in denial? I don’t know..

          • Linc

            Scott,
            I get what you mean by she is not a bad person and only you can determine if she is a bad person. I look at my side and say my wife is being a bad person. To have what I think is multiple affairs and do deny even though I have proof is just showing me she may care for me and love me but she doesn’t respect me enough to come clean and work through it. In a way I envy you that you know the truth and she has shown her true colors. I just want the truth and her to come clean and then I can process it. But without that I can’t move forward and am stuck in neutral. You need to do what is best for you. I feel like a loser sometimes that I am still with my wife and she is still lying (even if not seeing him anymore) because I am not getting the truth. I am sticking out the holidays mainly for my kids. My wife is acting normal and I assume she thinks everything is fine and we are moving forward. And that is my weakness. I am just sitting here and acting normal when I am actually dying inside. At some point I need to put my foot down and say enough is enough. Tell me the truth or I am leaving and even then I still may leave.

            Sorry to hijack your thread with my issues. I personally would not reach out to her. Let her feel the pain of not hearing from you and if she really wants it to work she will come back. If she doesn’t you have your answer and she was never coming back.

    • Scott

      Linc,
      Don’t feel bad about expressing your pains even on this thread. We are all experiencing many of the same feelings. You aren’t alone. I only just recently found out the entire truth and it wasn’t from her telling me herself. She was pretty much forced to from him after he found out she was still talking to me. She couldn’t keep up with the lies and they bit her. She would have continued the lies of both the AP and I didn’t find the truth of how much she has lied. You aren’t a loser for staying with her. You are hopeful and it’s understandable. That is the person you love. The one you have been most vulnerable to and made a life with. You’re not weak or anything for wanting to give it a chance still. I think you should express how you feel to your wife but not show that fully vulnerable and damaged side when you do, if that makes sense? You have boundaries and you have needs from her in all of this and she needs to be willing to work with you on that because your healing with trust and forgiveness is based on her helping you with that. Her denial is not good and she owes it to you to come clean if she is serious about working through things.

      On my side, I keep feeling so conflicted on talking to her again. I just want her to hear me and listen but it’s probably not going to reach her. But I keep feeling like maybe it will reach her…I feel so incredibly lost right now. The thought of losing her and our marriage and the life we have built is absolutely devastating to me. I just wish she would open her eyes but I know I can’t force her to see everything. How much she stands to lose and the damage she has caused.

      • Linc

        Scott,
        I know our situations are different but somewhat the same. Let me get your thoughts. This may be selfish on my part and it probably won’t help me feel better but it’s the way I feel now. I want her to feel some pain. Nobody knows what she did. I don’t think I mentioned above but I have proof (as close as I can get? That she has had two physical affairs and at least another EA that I have no reason to believe based on her track record that it was a PA. What pain has she had? She lost her boyfriend…sure maybe some emotional pain but nothing like what I have gone through. I want people to know who she is and what she has been doing. And if I stay and just work it out she wins. I know it’s not a game but why wouldn’t she do it again in the future if I just let her get away with it? It may be very selfish and childish but it’s how I feel. And maybe that shows I don’t want to work it out but I can’t get it out of my head that she got away with it. Have you felt this way? Do people know considering she wasn’t living with you for 6 months?

    • Scott

      Linc,

      Pretty much all of our mutual friends ended up getting dragged into the situation so many people know what she has been doing once I found out. She had brought them into the lies as well because she would avoid accountability. She says that people aren’t understanding her when it’s more that she wants to get what she wants and not have to face consequences or make decisions. Even when I told her to leave she wasn’t even the one who made a choice. I made it for her.

      Ultimately she needs to be transparent with you and admit to what she has done wrong and take accountability for it and pretty much ask you what she can do to fix things. If she can’t show you those things then you will be stuck in this same loop. The pain that she has had from losing those AP are pains but a completely different kind. The pains we feel going through these situations is much worse and really effects you forever honestly. I don’t like to compare pains much. But the pains felt being a BS are very grand. You definitely should put your foot down and tell her that she needs to be transparent with you because it’s pretty much torturing you. If it’s something she can’t comply with, there is most likely something she doesn’t want you to know.

    • Connie

      Linc, I can relate to your pain. My spouse also lied about his affair and I trusted and believed him. I just recently found out about the lie and now it feels like our whole marriage from that point on has been one big lie. He claims he thought I already knew that he hadn’t ended it. He says he loves me, wants our marriage to work and wants us to heal, and that all may be the truth, but the lying about other things is telling me he doesn’t respect or really value our relationship. It’s hard and like you I’m not sure what to do. He doesn’t get how much emotional pain he has caused. He doesn’t understand how bad the triggers are. He doesn’t understand how the memories can hurt so bad. He doesn’t understand how his AP ghosts haunts me because he brought her into our home, into our bedroom, into our bed, into our marriage and it feels like I have to compete with her ghost every damn day living in a home I once loved but now hate, and he won’t move because according to his way of thinking, moving won’t change anything. He has not really changed to work on our healing. My Philosophy is “NOTHING CHANGES IF NOTHING CHANGES!

      • Linc

        Thanks Connie. I am sorry you are going through this too. What hurts the most, well everything, but is the fact that she is acting normal and never asks me if I am ok. Everytime I have said “I am struggling” or “I am having a bad day” she may ask why….and I will say because of all of this shit. And she says “Yeah its tough on me too.” We haven’t talked about it in over a month. I wanted to give her space to think about everything and hopefully come clean. But I think she just thinks I have moved on. I am actually now feeling bad that after the holidays I may spring it on her that I am leaving because she won’t be honest and I can’t live with myself if I stay. But to be honest I don’t know if I am strong enough to walk away.

        I can’t imagine my wife bringing the AP to our house….I would want to burn it down. And I agree with the triggers…when I found out about the affair and she said they were just friends talking and would end it I put a GPS on her car and one day put a recorder in there just to test it out while we were driving. Well later that day she was going to the grocery store and I caught a conversation between them and them meeting up in the parking lot of the store. Not to mention it was a burner phone. This was pretty much proof it was more then friendship but she still says everything I heard was out of context….if I knew there friendship I would know she was joking….but there are things she said that when she says them to me or to our kids I get triggered.

        I think the only way to move on is to physically move on. I can’t see her everyday….I can’t think every time she leaves the house where is she really going….and if she did it more then once and I let her get away with it why would I think she wouldn’t do it again when things settle back down.

    • Trying

      From other’s experiences, how long did the affair fog last and what snapped your CS out of the fog?

      • Linc

        Trying,

        I am only 4 months in and still in a fog. I have butterflies in my stomach everyday. I wake up and first think about is the affairs. I don’t know how long it will last and I don’t know if will ever go away if I stay with my wife. I know people say an affair can make the marriage stronger but I just don’t see it. Everytime I look at my wife I think about what she did. How the days she knew she was meeting him she was probably so excited. How she got all dressed up for him. How she knew if I found out it would kill me and possibly end our marriage and our family the way we know it. And the excitement was worth the risk. I can’t believe she cared about me while she was doing this. She has shown no remorse or taking any responsibility.

        Hopefully your CS has shown remorse and will help you through it. I just don’t know how anyone gets through it. Sorry for not having better answers.

      • tryingtogetover

        An ultimatum, done via text between me, CS, and our marriage counselor, finally snapped him out of it. He realized this was real, I was calling him out, had the receipts (in the form of our phone bill listing all their calls when he was supposed to have cut her off), and our counselor witnessing it all and able to hold him accountable. Every time he tried to text just me, I would put our counselor back in as a referee, and finally the fog lifted and he saw the whole sad situation he dragged me into for what it was. Wishing you all the best chasing the fog away.

    • Lisa E

      WOW! It is amazing how you can go from hopeful to nothing so quickly. On Nov. 27 I posted how wonderful my husband had been and how he had finally told everything in September. LIES, LIES, LIES!
      I’m resonably certain that everyone on this blog has done similar things that I have. You have asked the questions a million times, a million different ways, hoping you would get a truthful answer, or maybe just something other than, “I don’t know.”
      “How did you meet them? When was the 1st time you had sex with them? How often were you seeing them? Were they ever at our home? Did your AP go out of town with you? Did you buy them gifts?” etc. etc. etc.! Often the answers from the CS are, “I have already answered that!” “How many times have I told you I NEVER____.” “Stop badgering me!”
      I am a Ordained Chaplain and board eligible in Clinical Pastoral Care. My job has been in a major hospital in the ED. SO, I have seen everything! I have seen the pain that people experience. However, the worst pain seen is a mother being told her child or children are dead (that’s my job along with the physician). The sound is the same from each mother. It is a painful wail that comes from somewhere you have no idea where that is, because it is the only sound and time you hear it. The pain that you feel from a spouse cheating must be very close to that feeling; but I could never compare it to losing a child.
      After my glowing report on the 27th of how my husband was being, I was faced with another bombshell on the 2nd and 3rd! Yes this week. My husband finally admitted that he had fallen in love with his AP. It is interesting how you know these things in your heart, you discuss them with your counselor, your friend(s), family, etc. but hearing the words are so much worse! I knew there was no way he was with someone from Jan. 2020 to supposedly end of April 2021 and not have very serious feelings. Afterall, when I caught him on the phone with her on July 10th , the sexual element had supposedly ended and they were, “just friends.” However, when I kicked him out of the house on July 16th after seeing he was still calling her who did he immediately call??? You got it, the AP.
      Do you know how many times I had asked him if he had loved her? I’m sure as many as you have. The answer I got was always, “It didn’t mean anything to me!!” OR the “I’ve already told you.” “I have answered that question!”
      Now, he comes forth and tells me he did fall in love with her and told her so in Feb. 2021. If that wasn’t bad enough, I have asked what gifts he bought for her and again, got the same old thing with the answers stated above. Now he tells me he bought her a birthday present in April. First of all, that is our daughters birthday month. Does my husband think I am so stupid that I didn’t get a survelliance report on her and I know about her drug convictions, her check fraud, her two illigetimate children, her 2 divorces, the fact she moves every 6mo. to a year… Of course, I know her birthday is July 21st! Nearly 24 years after my husband was born!!!! The reason he said April is because that is when he “claimed” the affair ended. (after she was out of town with him on April 25th). Let me add my birthday is July 6th and he forgot my birthday! Kinda hard to do when his mother shares the same day, but yes, mine wasn’t acknowledged. He was busy getting his “friend” a special vintage watch.
      I am devastated! He always says that it seems when he tells me the truth it sets us back. REALLY!!! When you get the trickle truths from July 10 to … let’s assume again a date, Dec. 2-3 is it! That is one week shy of 5 months!!!! For 5 months I have been dragged through hell on a regular basis.
      I told him last night that I was tired being his sloppy second. That taking me on a special Thanksgiving trip was disgusting because he treated me no different than an affair. If he loved her and thought that was where he was happy, call her and see if it can happen for him. He claims, that it is over, he looks at that time in his life as being poisonous, that he knows how disgusting a person he is and it is difficult to hear the words come out of his mouth regarding the things he has done. and the hurt he has inflicted on me. He also says, he loves me, he is in-love with me and he wants our marriage to work. Huh…
      How can I move forward? Is it normal that truths are still being revealed 5 months into being discovered? Does a CS REALLY want to work on their marriage when they continue to harbor lies?

    • Roberta

      What if you ask the unfaithful questions but his answers are lies? He tells some truth but mostly hes lying. Too many clusters and red flags and things that dont add up to be telling the truth. Changing his answer too many times cause he cant remember all the lies hes told.
      Its been 7 years and he still wont cone clean . How do i move on when i dont know the truth? Ive discovered so much more that he refuses to admit to but says im crazy and making up stories . Then he starts raging and saying i cheated first(no i didnt) and it turns into a loud fight and i will stop asking questions. He does this everytime .
      I dont know what to do or how i will ever get over this without the truth. Im the kind of person who wants to know it all.

      • Linc

        Hi Roberta,

        I know a lot of us feel similar to you. I don’t know how it will feel in 7 years. I have only been in this shape for 4 months. I sometimes envy people that have been able to get through this and move on with the CS. Sometimes I can’t imagine how that can be done. I am still with my CS but I don’t know if it will last. Similar to you I am not getting the truth. She has never admitted to anything not if a EA. They were just friends. I know that isn’t true so I see this as still being unfaithful and lying. I have sucked it up and we haven’t talked about the issues for over a month now. It is killing me inside and I will never be able to move on with out 100% honesty. So I think I have to leave my wife after the holidays and do this to help myself. I don’t know what it will do to my children but staying won’t help my kids if I am miserable all the time.

        So going back to your point I don’t know how you have been able to last 7 years. You need to do what is best for yourself. And if he isn’t being honest then in my opinion he doesn’t respect you and thinks you will suck it up and just stay (I think this about my wife). You deserve to be happy.

    • Linc

      Hi,

      I have posted a lot on this thread and looking for advice. I think I know the answer but it would be great to hear it from other people. So as mentioned above it has been over 4 months since DDay and my wife still denies everything even though I have solid proof. I even think (no real direct proof) that she is still communicating with the other guy. She slipped up to her friend who I talk to in late Nov and said she told “the other guy” that the friend agreed with her about my being very negative. They had that conversation in mid Nov so they have been in touch even though she said they stopped talking in early Sept. Well we haven’t discussed or fought about her affair since Halloween. I decided to let the holidays play out and make sure everything was great for my kids. She has been acting normal and I have been playing along also. Even going out to dinner and being intimate. But I can’t live this way. So after the new year I need to confront her and tell her I am leaving if she won’t be honest and come clean….and even if she does it still might be too much to stay. Am I wrong to feel bad that I am going to drop this bombshell on her? I almost feel I have been acting normal and this will be my fault if I end it. Just looking for some thoughts and if anyone has had similiar situations. Thanks and happy holidays to everyone I really appreciate your support.

    • Doug

      Hey Linc, I hope that you managed to have a nice holiday and that your kids enjoyed it as well. Personally, I do not think that you should feel bad at all about dropping the bombshell on your wife. You have set boundaries and they need to be respected and adhered to. And if not, there needs to be some kind of consequence for your wife. Only you can decide what they are. Right now, she probably feels that she is in the clear since all seems “normal.” I’m sorry if you’ve mentioned here somewhere, but am I to assume that you have confronted your wife with your “solid proof?” If not, you need to do so and give her the opportunity to come clean with respect to your proof, as well as your suspicions. If she still refuses, then perhaps you need to make some tough decisions about your next course of action.

    • Linc

      Hi Doug,

      Thank you for your reply. I haven’t confronted her with everything I have. But the most damning evidence, voice recording when they talked en route to a secret meeting, she knows I have. I have only shared a 20 second clip of it. I have discussed what she has said on it and she says it is all out of context and if I understood their friendship I would know it meant nothing.

      My goal is to put most everything I know (may hold back a few things because it would give up source’s) on paper and confront her with it all. Tell her you and I both know you have been having affairs and you don’t want to admit it. It’s fine you don’t have to. You are an adult and can choose what you tell me and actually what you do. And I can do the same. So I am leaving you because I can’t get past the lies. Here is all the info I have and the overwhelming proof.

      I plan to have my kids schedule for the following two weeks lined up on what I plan to do (rides to basketball and games) and tell her I am not talking to her. Text me if it is about the kids other then that let’s plan to sit down in a few weeks to discuss finances and the separation.

      • Lisa E

        Linc,
        I think that affairs are similar and still very different–if that makes any sense. As the betrayed we wait, wanting desperately to know the truth and details. I caught my husband on July 10th after he was in his affair for 1 1/2 years. WOW! I knew things were off, he was not eating at home, the shower was dry (I am gone 14 hours, 3 days a week at work in an Emergency Room). He was buying new shoes, clothes, aftershave, underwear (I have always done those things). He was getting his hair cut more frequently, working out more intensely…
        My husband claimed she was a friend and that was all! From 7/10 to the weekend of 8/13 he lied, denied, and protected himself. I was relentless (in a nice way). I would not give up. Finally, the evening of Aug. 13th, I gave the ultimatum. I told him I would not go on this way. He had 3 choices, 1) sit here and tell the truth. (note: I had found a prescription for Cialis and we were not having sex. In other words, I was not reaping any benefits from this sex enhancer). 2) Take a lie detector test to proof you are telling the truth or 3) We can call it quits and I will start divorce proceedings.
        He sat there and told me, lie detector tests aren’t accurate. As I told him, “They are accurate enough.” I went through the questions again, and again. I could not believe that my husband was choosing a divorce! I finally stood up and said, “O.K., I’ll contact some attorneys on Monday and start the divorce. ” He gently grabbed my arm and in humiliation told me, “I won’t pass a lie detector test.”
        Linc, believe me, this was only the beginning! Over the next 36 hours I heard, truth, lies, truth, half-truths, etc. This was the start of admitting to a sexual relationship with an OW.
        That was mid-August. I then heard over and over, when I would ask questions. “Why do you keep asking that? I’ve already told you.” “That’s everything!” “There is nothing else to tell.” I never____ (took her out of town, spent the night there, bought her a gift…) take your choice. All were lies that took months to come out!
        July 10 until December 2nd! December 2nd, I THINK, he finally revealed everything. I have been dragged through HELL on a regular basis these past 5 months! I’m certain you feel the same. When I came in from my run on Dec. 2nd, my husband, was sitting on the sofa and said, “I need to tell you something.” This WAS THE 1st TIME HE OFFERED INFORMATION WITHOUT MY PROMPTING! I was sick to my stomach for this very reason.
        Of course, D Day is one of the most devastating times of your life. Then, if you are like me, you want to know everything: When did you kiss first, where did you first have sex, did you love him/her, did you go out of town…. my endless questions. BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU ASK! YOU CANNOT UNASK!
        Probably, after the discovery, the worst thing was knowing that my husband lied to me about being out of town and he was really staying with her at her home. Then, that fact he invited her out of town (45 min) from home. He never asked me to meet him when he was out of town.
        However, the last “2” things he had to tell me have been horrible. I had run a report on the OW, so I knew quite a lot. She was 24 years younger, when her birthday was….

        My husband admitted on Dec. 2nd that he had fallen in love with her and had expressed his feelings to her frequently. After the breakup, he bought her a birthday present. Her birthday happens to be 15 days after mine. My husband had forgotten my birthday this year. I presume my gift was on July 10th when I caught him on the phone with her (the D day beginnings)! These two revelations were heartbreaking for me.
        All of this, to let you know, discovery for most of us that are betrayed, is not a one time thing. It is an ongoing torture. I am glad that on Friday evening, August 13th, I gave my husband those 3 choices. He would have held fast to his secret and lies had I not given him choices that evening. I feel like I put the ball in his court. No one likes to be backed in a corner and as humans we tend to push back or cower. This gave him some power, in a way.
        The pain is excruciating and we are doing hard work to move forward. I have explained to my husband that the affair is nothing compared to the constant lies and then discovering the opposite is true. Example: “I never bought her anything, for Christmas’, Valentines Day, her Birthday… Truth: He bought her an expensive Vintage watch. “I have no idea where she lives.” Truth: He slept there, ate there, visited there. EVEN helped her move to a new place.
        My guess is, she already knows you know. She just doesn’t know to what extent and how! You can’t really worry about your sources if you want to save your marriage; and they should understand. After all, they gave you the information for a reason.
        Linc, my heart is with you. I understand every feeling you are going through. I am praying for you. As matter of fact, several times a day I say a prayer for those that are facing D Day at that moment. It is a rough road.

        • Linc

          Hi Lisa,

          Thanks for your response. It seems like we found out about the same time. She knows I know. And I think she has a pretty good idea that I know enough to know she had a physical relationship with this last guy. I don’t know the details. Like when they first kissed or had sex or anything like that. And I understand what you mean by be careful what you ask for cause you can’t unask….but I don’t know if knowing the truth can be worse then what is going through my head. But it probably could be.

          As for my sources I will never reveal them. I would rather lose my marriage then friendships because they did the right thing and told me what they found out. And to be honest I don’t know if I want to save my marriage. I am not sure I want to be with a person that could most likely have had multiple affairs over the last few years and feels no remorse for it.

          My goal was to give her time to come clean like your husband did. I did give some ultimatums but she didn’t bite and I folded.

          I have changed my plans a little bit but still need to get he courage to follow through. I can’t give her some of the info I have because the recording that I did, and she knows about, was technically illegal. In the state I live it you need both parties consent to record and if I provide her with all the details and a copy so she can hear which I was planning I may be causing some legal problems for me if she wants to pursue it.

          I think I have found some of my own proof she is still talking to the other guy. Nothing concrete but she used facebook messanger to talk to him in the past. Her facebook for some reason doesn’t show her active if she is in facebook but only shows active while in messenger. She doesn’t know this. I was able to look at her phone briefly the other day and I could see based on screen time that she was on messenger for 21 min and had 24 notifications on New Years Eve. But when I looked at her actually messenger the newest message was from the previous Sunday. So the messages to those notifications were deleted. Not a smoking gun but where there is smoke there is fire.

          I know I don’t need more proof….and in reality I can leave her for any reason but it would make me feel better about my decision to have proof they are still talking. As I mentioned we have been acting normal and I want to show her that I know she is doing this behind my back still and she has made the decision to leave for me.

          • Lisa E

            Linc,
            So sorry! I understand the things going through your head. I wonder if that ever goes away??? You know what you know, for females we call it ‘women’s intuition.’ I knew in my heart and mind my husband had to have loved the OW. Hearing him say it was much more devastating. However, I am with you, you need to hear the truth.
            My prayers for you in whatever your decision. I have felt like, I am damned if I leave and I am damned if I stay. We know we will hurt no matter what. YOU JUST NEED PEACE!

    • Lisa

      I wish I had found this site sooner, but after an excruciating 5 months, this is what I learned… if your cheating spouse is having ambivalence about you and the affair partner… end it! This is the only way to stop the madness. Start working on yourself and get strong. I had several D days until I ended it and was prepared to move on. I ended it and it took 2 days for him to realize he wanted me back. I had already kicked him out and we had been trying to work on things apart. I had turned into someone I didn’t recognize. I started stalking him, tracking his truck, recording conversations to catch him in lies… it was killing me. It took a month after he said he wanted me back before I let him come back. It took another 2 months before he really started to feel remorse and started to put effort in. He has read/ listened to several books I asked him to and we are going to therapy (EFT). The thing is, if I had the guts to “end it” sooner, I could have saved myself months of grief and more crappy memories. Whether he came back or not, I was better off not trying to make him love me and stop seeing the affair partner.

    • Hopeless

      My husband is so stuck in his shame. Or who knows if it’s shame at this point. It’s been almost 2 years since dday. 1 year since we started working on our marriage and here we are. Separated because he couldn’t help me. It’s what everyone is saying in all these comments. He keeps saying he’s unhappy. He doesn’t respect me and he doesn’t want to do this again. He feels entitled for me to show him all this love without the work. I’m broken he is okay with separating but what else can I do. He’s moved out. He still will text me and say things like we didn’t show love to one another. We weren’t happy. Blah blah blah.
      I don’t even know if it’s shake anymore. He’s not empathetic. Not remorseful. He’s more sad when he talks about what he thinks people think about him, how people at work lost respect for him. I just can’t anymore. But a loss of a marriage is hard even if they hurt you so much. He did the bare minimum. We did couples sessions. Pointless. He’s emotionally immature Ive realized. I’m stuck now with him for next 18+ years because we have a 1 year old.

    • Nik

      Is it possible for a marriage to survive an affair if there is a child as a result of the affair?

    • Lisa E

      Nik, I am so sorry for the extreme pain and anguish you must be feeling and what you are trying to reconcile in your heart. That is an element I cannot even begin to comprehend. An affair is difficult enough. For a child to enter the equation is something that would require extreme kindness, self-denial and love. I think a counselor is in order to work through those elements as part of an affair–talk about a complete new level!

    • Lisa E

      It has been a rough few months since my husband finally told, what I assume are all the truths, in December.
      The teeter-totter of his going from cheater to healer is non-existent. He finds more reasons it is “my fault” he had the affair, and more requirements for the marriage to work.
      I have been so overwhelmed I attempted to end my life. NOT ADVICEABLE! I ended up in the hospital for 1 1/2 weeks, and a mental hospital for another 1 1/2 weeks, and then an out-patient mental health program for another 2 weeks. So, I haven’t been on “the outside” but a few weeks now. Can’t say I feel much better.
      If a spouse can only answers with: “I don’t know.” “It didn’t mean anything.” “I answered already,” (which was “I don’t Know…” ) then you will never find peace. It is so true that, ‘the betrayer must become the healer,’ if the CS doesn’t grasp that then they are not ready to grasp you and love you the way you should be loved.
      I read in my devotional reading the other day, ‘the interests we are passionate about we give our time, money, effort, and persistence.’ What a lightbulb moment. My husband gave all those things to his AP and now, claiming to love me and wanting that with me, shows none of them. Again, an old saying–You actions speak so loud, I can’t hear your words.

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