How to Talk Truthfully with Your Partner After Your Affair

In our recent book, Healing from an Affair – A cheater’s guide to helping your spouse heal from your affair, we establish 27 tasks that a cheater must be willing to do in order to heal.  One of the top tasks was to talk about the affair, your feelings and your relationship issues.  Unfortunately, most cheaters hate (and may refuse) to do it.

Of course, when you’re talking there should always be honesty.  However, sometimes it’s not always the best thing to be 100% completely honest if it hurts or in some way further traumatizes your partner.

Most marriage counselors are fairly strict in their insistence that each partner in a marriage be completely honest with each other at all times. But common sense and basic decency often make this a very difficult proposition.

For instance, if I’m out with Linda celebrating our anniversary or whatever, and I notice a beautiful woman, it would be pretty stupid for me to casually mention to Linda how stunning the woman was. 

By sharing this truth with her in this situation I would have left her with a very bad feeling about herself, about me and about the evening in general. Such honesty would do nothing to improve our situation or our evening, but I’m sure I would have learned a fairly decent lesson about marriage – it’s not a good idea to share every thought or every observation that enters my mind.

Dr. Scott Haltzman in his new book The Secrets of Surviving Infidelity, says that for any one situation there are many truths and when it comes to having an honest discussion about your affair, you have to choose which truth you share with him or her. 

That doesn’t mean that you should lie.  Rather, you must be thoughtful about the impact of your statements.

4 Principles for Truthful Communication After Your Affair

If you are the one who committed infidelity, Dr. Haltzman says there are some principles that you need to keep in mind when you try to talk truthfully with your partner about the affair, your feelings and your marriage.

  • Take a good self inventory.
  • Consider your spouse’s feelings before you talk.
  • Don’t couch things in criticism, overt or hidden, of your mate.
  • Don’t use a confession as a means for you to feel better if it means hurting your spouse.

Take a good self inventory. Before you can talk with your spouse about what caused the affair and how you felt about it before, during and after, you must stand up to the mirror and do a considerable amount of self-exploration. Haltzman says that when you try to answer the questions about why you do things you do, you must distinguish between reason and rationalization. You must figure out your reasons and not your rationalizations for why you had the affair.

Some of the reasons for infidelity that were mentioned but Dr. Haltzman were sexual enjoyment, curiosity, excitement, intellectual sharing, understanding, companionship, ego-bolstering, career advancement and getting even with your spouse.

Obviously there are more than just these but as you look at this short list deducing the clues about what may have contributed to your infidelity, are there additional reasons that don’t appear on this list? In some cases it may just not be possible to make sense out of why you did what you did. But don’t pass the affair off as just a one-time mistake. If necessary, find professional help through a therapist or counselor who can help you figure out what propelled you in the direction of an affair.

Consider your spouse’s feelings before you talk.  Your partner didn’t ask you to have this affair and now that he or she is asking for serious discussions about it, you should consider how he or she best receives information before you decide how to address things.

It’s good to know your partner’s communication style and this involves not only understanding what she or he says but also what goes unspoken. Reading your partner involves long periods of observation occasional questioning and even testing out your various hypotheses. You may have to check that what you’re doing is along the right path and say things like “Am I reading you right when you raise your voice after I said that, that you are angry?”

When you have a discussion with your partner consider how he or she would like to be addressed and what kinds of words work best.  If he or she doesn’t respond the way you expect then maybe it has to do with your presentation and not necessarily your partner’s attitude.

Don’t couch things in the criticism, overt or hidden, of your mate.  If you try to make sense of your transgressions during the time you’re having an affair, it’s easy to point the finger of blame in the direction of your partner. While your spouse may bear some responsibility in the deterioration of your marriage, that really isn’t the issue.

Everyone’s relationship could use a little work over time and all partners could and should work harder to forge stronger bonds with their spouses. That is no reason to have an affair. When someone whose life is turned upside down is told that he or she is responsible for the affair, that’s just not right.

“Even if you feel your relationship problems contributed to your unhappiness (and in many cases they have), you should still be very clear that the decision to have an affair was yours to make. You cannot blame your partner. When it comes to discussing your feelings and thoughts with your mate the word “I” should be front and center, and the word “You” barely spoken.”

Don’t make yourself feel better if it means hurting your spouse.  Affairs are pretty terrible things and if you had an affair you probably feel remorse for what you’ve done. Talking about the affair will give you an opportunity to discuss its emotional impact on you: the confusion, the ambivalence, the shame and, perhaps your passion to make amends.

Sometimes baring your soul may feel like redemption for you, but it may be torture for your partner. Be considerate of how your words are affecting your mate. If early on in the process of disclosure, you pour your heart out looking for sympathy or forgiveness, your partner may start feeling pretty annoyed. In the context of the pain that he or she is experiencing, the idea that your torment must be given full attention just doesn’t seem fair.

You may feel tormented. You’ve done a bad thing. But restrain yourself from trying to draw the attention away from your mate’s experience. Instead pace your own disclosure of emotional pain so it doesn’t exceed your partners.

Note:  We purchased and read The Secrets of Surviving Infidelity and feel that it is a good book – especially for those who may have recently discovered infidelity.  After reading so many books over the years we can’t really say that this book contains anything Earth-shattering, but Dr. Haltzman is certainly pro-marriage and provides a practical guide for surviving infidelity and healing your relationship.


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96 Responses to How to Talk Truthfully with Your Partner After Your Affair

  1. exercisegrace August 9, 2013 at 3:29 pm #

    The sad thing is, after bomb-drop it seems like the pain just begins for the betrayed spouse, and for the cheating spouse they feel like it is finally “over”. The CS has so much relief in letting go of the big secret and living a double life, they just want it to end. The betrayed spouse is (typically, it seems) the one reading books, blogs, boards, seeking advice etc. while my husband was remorseful and agreed to attend counseling and whatever I required to stay…..he mostly wanted it over with. He answered my questions, apologized and then wanted the total focus to be FORWARD. He didn’t understand why I had to keep revisiting the past, fact-checking, and wanting details. His attitude was more….I’m here, I chose YOU. And he couldn’t see why that enraged me to hear those words.

    • forcryin'outloud August 9, 2013 at 5:43 pm #

      EG – It is just like a bomb goes off. Everything as you knew it is destroyed or changed forever without any input into any of it.

      Like your H I remember mine saying how the relief was enormous and how much better he felt. I believe his exact words were “I’ve never felt better about us.” Boy, that one really didn’t compute. And I too was told he chose me and he stayed he didn’t leave be so I could let my guard down and move forward. Do they really believe you can quickly move forward when the person you trusted the most as an adult has lied to you over and over again?

      • Paula August 9, 2013 at 5:55 pm #

        FCOL, the first MC we saw told my partner that whilst the relief was huge for him, that he had sixteen months to come to terms with the fact that he was having an affair, and to “work through” the whole process – he worked out fairly early on that it wasn’t for him, and that he had cocked up (pardon the terrible pun) and was then back-peddling, trying to find a way to end it without her going psycho on our family, including, completely unbeknownst to me, her extorting money from him, and threatening our children, etc! The MC said to him, “Paula will need AT LEAST as long to come to terms with her altered reality, and she also has to deal with the fact that SHE never chose any of this, at least you had active choice.” Man, that felt both scary and AMAZING to hear. I wasn’t completely crazy (I already knew that, but validation, ya know!) But sixteen months to recover, no way, I was gonna nail that, hopefully in half the time, lol! The innocence, and confidence I had back then….;-)

        • forcryin'outloud August 9, 2013 at 8:13 pm #

          Amen to the innocence and confidence. Boy has that train left the station. 😀

        • gracefortoday August 10, 2013 at 1:05 pm #

          Paula and FCOL, our marriage counselor told my husband basically the same. He knew pretty much from the start that he had made a mistake. While he enjoyed the admiration and ego-jacking, he hated himself for what he was doing and even the sex was not good as the guilt impeded performance!

          Paula, I felt very validated by our therapist too, who told him (while he was looking for “time off for good behavior” for not leaving me, ending it himself etc) that he had betrayed and violated me on MULTIPLE levels. Not just the physical act of the affair, but that it was IN OUR HOME, that he tried to make me feel guilty and crazy and go on meds for even daring to THINK he could/would do something like that…..when the whole time he was saying this, he WAS. He is struggling with how long this is taking to work through, to build trust. He is so over it. He had so much more time and of course, OBVIOUSLY when we are the ones who have done a horrible wrong, we want to just not think about it ever again. Too painful!.

          • exercisegrace August 10, 2013 at 1:07 pm #

            oops, this is me, exercisegrace….don’t know why it did that

            • Paula August 10, 2013 at 8:21 pm #

              Man, EG, we are living parallels, in our home, too, well, you ask “friends” there, don’t you, I even was fine with her being there while I wasn’t. Because he was THAT good a liar, he never skipped a beat in sixteen months, even after he had ended it! Not one foot wrong in his elaborate and intricate house of whoring lies, not once. The amount of self-bum-kicking I have done over the past four years….I’m black and blue. Even now, I cannot see how he did it, how he looked me in the eye, bare-face lied, over and over and over, “made love” to me after her, vomit, puke, die, and I never had a bloody clue! What planet was I on??? I used to be known as an intuitive person, someone who picked up on subtle body language, nervous ticks, that kind of stuff, I always “knew” when someone else’s marriage was on the rocks, too close? Never again, never again will I trust another human like this. Never. Ever. Again.

    • tryinghard August 10, 2013 at 8:47 am #

      Are you certain we aren’t twins living in some parallel universe? Or no, wait, our husbands are twins living in some parallel universe! True that what you said Sister.

      • exercisegrace August 10, 2013 at 1:08 pm #

        twins indeed! Sigh.

  2. Paula August 9, 2013 at 4:17 pm #

    EG, oh yeah! Being “chosen” was what you thought happened at the beginning. Once. You don’t even know there’s a competition on. Winning! Great. They don’t seem to understand that the thorough investigation of the immediate past is just disbelief. “What? But we were happy. We did this, this and this. All was normal and loving. But he was doing THAT? How, when, why, where? Mine didn’t appear to have possibly physically have had the time to conduct a sexual affair with someone who lived three hours away, for fifteen months? What was I doing then? Why was I blind? How??? Just trying to find a way to fit the story into MY reality was important and extremely hard.

  3. Paula August 9, 2013 at 4:20 pm #

    Oh, meant to add, of course you have to choose each other every day, but that just seemed a given and something I demonstrated to him daily. Thought he was doing the same. He still told me and showed me how much he loved me. How was I to know???

    • exercisegrace August 10, 2013 at 1:15 pm #

      Paula…EXACTLY. I actually did think my marriage vows meant I had CHOSEN HIM. That it was not something negotiable. That the vows said nothing about until some whore comes along that makes your wife look like the less attractive option, then by all means go stand in line to ride the tilt-a-whore and see what you think!

      You describe my emotions so precisely. I always thought him completely incapable. The OW asked him throughout the affair, over and over….you still love her, dont’ you? And he would say yes, and that he wasn’t leaving. When they first met he told her what a great marriage, and family we had. How HAPPY he was. She went….CHALLENGE ACCEPTED. By her OWN admission she pursued him aggressively and over a long period of time. She admitted that she was determined to break him down. SICK SICK SICK.

      I also agree about the TIME. My husband works from home and she worked with him! I was HERE most of time. Never thought he could do THAT in our own home. He was very creative about his texting and emailing on his phone. Always with a good story about a client that needed an answer blah blah blah. Bottom line, if someone WANTS to cheat they WILL. Where there is a will, there is a way………are truer words than have ever been spoken.

  4. Strengthrequired August 9, 2013 at 6:59 pm #

    What is it with “I choose you” comment. Like we won a major prize. My h chose me over her a month after dday, he moved back home, yet how can you choose someone, while still investing alot of your time in the op?
    I believed in our marriage so much, I didn’t believe he actually wanted her, yet after months of him lying and still seeing her, txting her, I started to think that maybe he really did want her and he was trying to get me to leave him,by making himself feel better, not trying to get her to leave him like he said.
    When your married for so long, your h/w should know you love them, why do they make you prove it to them, they should already know, everyday you told them you loved them, you were there by their side everyday, you are raising their kids, you make love to them, you promised to love them for the rest of their life. Yet some floosy can walk right in and for a moment have them forget. It’s ridiculous.
    We didn’t forget,

    • forcryin'outloud August 9, 2013 at 8:11 pm #

      I told my Mom I felt like I had passed the graduate level marriage class final and he was the professor with trick question after trick question.

  5. Karen August 9, 2013 at 8:35 pm #

    My cs shows no remorse, has not made a decent apology, and refuses to talk about it or answer my questions . He gets verbally abusive when I continue to press for details. This is his second emotional affair with the same coworker. He had the first one 18 years ago and moved back to her building 2 years ago and resumed or renewed the affair. Nobody really explains what to do with a spouse who has no remorse and just wants it to be forgotten and all go away and just take up the marriage where it left off. I cannot get over it or begin to heal until I know what happened and whether or not he really stopped the affair. I have no way of knowing this for sure as all communication is done on his work phone to which I have no access. I have been in pain for 8 months, he has watched me suffer, wreck my health, and cry every night. I need to ” get over it” ( his words tome), but I cannot seem to do so. I can’t get him to be open, honest, transparent, or even give me enough of his time to attempt to talk without him glancing at his watch every few minutes. I am giving up after 8 months of chances for him to “fix” things. I’m done. Talking doesn’t always work or even happen.

    • Mona Lisa August 9, 2013 at 10:17 pm #

      Karen, it’s time to start taking care of yourself!!! Forget about what is going on with your stupid husband. Beginning now, quit letting him see you being weak and as a victim. I know how hard this is because I have lived it myself. My husband watched me just about have a breakdown and acted like he didn’t give a shit. Make up your mind to be strong!!! Do whatever it takes! Exercise, go shopping, do lunch dates with a girlfriend, etc. I know it’s hard to believe, but if you set your mind to it, you will come out of this deep, dark, hole. I have made up my mind that regardless of what happened with ” left brain” I will survive and thrive! You can too! Good luck!

    • tryinghard August 10, 2013 at 8:56 am #

      Oh yes you do have a choice!!! And you can access his phone even if it is a work phone. There are devices you can buy that downloads every phone number and text message. There is also a website that hacks phones. May not be legal but it CAN be done. Private Investigator firms can do this too. Not remorseful, abusive, inattentive? The beat just keeps going on. Do not stand for it.

    • Battle born August 11, 2013 at 7:23 pm #

      Karen, most people know my story here so I won’t spend time repeating it except to say I was an abused spouse… Severely abused. If I can tell you one thing it would be get away from your h NOW. It is not much of a step to take verbal abuse to physical abuse and you cannot take that chance. I stayed with my spouse (not this one) and it just got worse because was i not strong enough to get out. Verbally abusing anyone is emotionally destructive for along time, it takes the breath out of you and severely stunts your heart. It makes loving anyone hard in the future because you are afraid to voice your opinions.

      We cannot tell you what to do, but I am telling you this is not acceptable and very dangerous.

  6. Karen August 10, 2013 at 12:38 am #

    Mona, did you divorce him? I have been married 35 years… I’m finding its hard to let go, even with the abuse, which has escalated to some physical intimidation. I am trying to be strong and I do have days in which I feel strong. Luckily school will start up soon and that will take a large chunk of my time and give me something else to keep my mind off of it. I am living upstairs and he is living downstairs. We are basically just housemates. I am looking for a place to live that I can afford on my teachers salary. Once I move out, I think I will feel much stronger… And much safer. Thank you for your advice!

    • tryinghard August 10, 2013 at 9:03 am #


      Good for you with your plans. Stay on this site. It gives a lot of support. You are a smart woman who does not deserve this. I too have been married over 35 years. They think they know us so well. They knew the old us. The one that made their lives easy and good. The one that believed in them. Not the same person anymore. What Mona Lisa said. Get out and do for yourself. It’s hard because all you want to do is crawl in the bed and pull the sheets over your head. That’s ok too. When he sees you are pulling away he will get the message. One of two things will happen. 1. He will start making the changes he needs to make for you and the marriage or 2. You will go your separate ways. Both are scary because your marriage will not be the same. Ever. You will wonder WTF now constantly. You will question if it’s even worth it and sometimes it’s not! You take care and like I said stay with us. We are the only ones who understand. No one who has not been in this situation understands the gravity of this kind of betrayal.

    • Mona Lisa August 10, 2013 at 7:11 pm #

      Karen, yes! I put my garbage on the curb! We were married 20 years. Now listen to what I am telling you… I am not an attorney BUT I did stay at a Holiday Inn once (ha,ha). Anyway, if your H is unwilling to stop the affair, give you answers, and is content to live in the same house, in different places, it’s time for you to get a serious plan together. Start putting some money into a separate account. I did this for several weeks until I built up a stash for the money I knew I would need to sustain me for a short time. As others have said, don’t leave your home. Due to your husband being abusive, the first thing is to obtain an emergency protective order from the family court. Request the judge allow you to stay in the home until the case comes to court and order your H to vacate. Change the locks too. The fact that you have assets is in your favor. Take HALF of everything!! It belongs to you! Hell, you’ve worked 35 years for it! Don’t forget to ask for half of his retirement and you can also get a portion of his social security, and he can pay you your portion of his 401K. Depending on your state laws you may be able to get spousal maintenance also. Your husband is a bully and he thinks you won’t call his hand. You are an educated woman! Use your brain . As far as contacting the other woman’s husband, I say do it! I did!!! Once the whole shit-show is exposed, the fun meter for your cheating H and his hilljack hoe goes way down. Now I know some people won’t agree with my advice and that’s OK. However, I left with a substantial amount of money, half his retirement from 2 jobs, a motorhome, most of the furniture, and a piece of mind that’s hard to put a price on!!! My theory is …. You gotta pay to play !! I hope my ex has bread and water with a side order of that fat whore for every meal! Oh wait, do I sound a little bitter?

      • Paula August 10, 2013 at 8:09 pm #

        Mona, I just LOVE that! And so damn true! Best practical “legal” advice prize goes to YOU. Thank you. Yep, you jointly own farmland, and maybe he should have just thought about how much he loves his 401K (retirement fund?? I am non-US) before doing what he did. That is supposed to be how it works, “oh, I have things I don’t want to lose, think very carefully Mr Penis, do you really want to do this and lose all of this comfort?” Simple maths. Don’t you back down, YOU have forgiven him once, 18 years ago, he didn’t “get” the enormity of the gift, so now he loses, good and proper. God they are idiots, and you wonder how man haters are made?!

  7. Paula August 10, 2013 at 5:41 am #

    Karen. You don’t have to divorce to be strong and independent. Not always. Sometimes they see you get stronger and less needy, and THEY make the changes required. No guarantees. You don’t make these changes for this reason either. This is ALL about you and how awesome YOU are. But sometimes it is a by-product. My heart breaks for you, 35 years is a huge chunk to be looking at, we are just 25, and that seems so sad, another 10 years. So many here with these long love stories. Best of luck. You can’t heal if he won’t take the steps required in dissecting what went wrong as the betrayed spouse never feels safe again without the cheater doing this, for them, and for themselves. It’s called personal growth and accountability.

  8. Karen August 10, 2013 at 8:12 am #

    Paula, thank you for your sweet comment. I wish I FELT awesome and could just be that strong and I AM working on it. I am planning to move out soon for a while to see if I even feel that this marriage can be saved or if I even truly want to save it…. I feel any man who has had a second affair with the same woman( even if 18 years have passed between affairs and he recently admitted to me that the first one WAS an emotional affair), must have feelings for her. I forgave the first time. BUT the first time is a mistake, the second time is a conscious choice. I am beginning to feel that I am only being kept around because, in my state, assets are split 50-50 in a divorce, and he has a sizable chunk of farmland and a hefty 401k that he doesn’t want to lose. He will not initiate any ” talks” to try to fix things and seems content with our current living arrangements ( me upstairs, him downstairs). He just gets angry when I try to get him to talk about the OW. It’s like he’s protecting her or something. When i threatened to go to her husband, he begged me to not destroy THEIR marriage, but doesnt seem concerned about ours. So, while I feel I AM stronger than I was several months ago, I am no closer to healing or ” getting over it” as he so eloquently put it. I don’t know where I really stand. While he SAYS he loves me, his actions just don’t show it.How can a man love a woman and verbally and physically threaten her? How can he love me and watch me suffer for 8 months? But you are right….. I need to show him a stronger side and quit acting so upset and needy and by moving out, maybe this will communicate that to him. Or not… We’ll see.

    • Rachel August 10, 2013 at 2:06 pm #

      I know things are difficult but I suggest for you not to move out.
      If divorce is in your future, you could lose the house .
      My h also said that I couldn’t contact his “soulmate” because their marriage could be good know and “we” dont want him coming after us. Us???? I said he’s gonna come after your skinny ass because you have been having an affair with his wife for 25 years.
      The beast my soon to be ex is his girl friend from 30 years ago. She gave up my h for her current husband. She is miserable and so sorry that she gave him up 30 years ago blah, blah, blah.
      Well, she can have him! The verbal abuse took me down for years and I am a different person. I wasn’t her and he couldn’t change me as much as he tried.
      We had the same living situation as you. After he declared his love for mrs beastly he wouldn’t leave. Texting under the counter, coming home drunk very late at night. Finally this past November he left. PEACE! Finally!!
      The divorce is going to trial because the ex is having issues giving me money.
      Best of luck, Karen.

      Try to get a strong support group to help you get through this terrible situation.
      You deserve better and you are much stronger than you think.

  9. Patsy50 August 10, 2013 at 11:43 am #

    Verbal and physical abuse is never accepted ever — period.

    If a spouse is not willing to talk, answer questions and do whatever is necessary to repair the relationship, marriage, then I don’t know how you can repair the marriage. Living as roommates does not help in repairing the relationship at all.
    As others have said on here, you must take care of yourself. Show him you are not standing for any of his shit.

    You are not destroying the other marriage, the OW made that choice already.

    I have been with my husband since I was fifteen year old. Married almost 43 years. He told me about his EA with a coworker 30 years younger then himself. He asked for a second chance, did everything asked of him to repair this very long marriage. It can be done just have to find what works in your case. Maybe it’s staying or divorce but you have to be ok with your decision either way.

    I hope you find your inner strength however it turns out.
    Good Luck to you in this journey, one which we never had a choice in making.

  10. Paula August 10, 2013 at 6:25 pm #

    Oh hear, hear to all of the above. Never, ever tolerate abuse. No way! If you can get HIM to be the one to move out, do it. Be careful not to open yourself to legal loopholes. It can be hard if your home is also his/your place of business (it is in my case) but if he did the crime why should you have to move? My boss (a good friend) said to me, “DO NOT leave the property.” That said, don’t stay and get progressively more miserable in a Mexican standoff either! Sanity is worth so much more than property. It is hard to heal with a truly remorseful and helpful spouse. Impossible if they are neither.

  11. Rachel August 10, 2013 at 9:18 pm #

    Like that Paula. If he did the crime, why should you have to move!
    I’ll never forget my 20 year old said to me, “thank you for not leaving when he told you to”.

  12. Tryinghard August 10, 2013 at 11:47 pm #

    What everyone has said is good advice. I agree with every word. I need to add that if he is not remorseful, if he is being abusive, if you are living separate lives I would bet my life the affair is still going on. You are a smart, educated woman like Mona Lisa said. Move quietly and start making your plans. You have a good job to support yourself and you will get half of your marital property. When I made the move to a lawyer after a few weeks my husband saw his. He told him what a bad ass lawyer I had and that he would fight for everything for me. I think the term rabid dog came into the conversation. Suddenly Miss White Trash didn’t look so appealing. I was still going to go forward with taking him to the cleaners and I made it very clear I would not back down. He came around be ause a lot of other things about her came to light about her I.e he saw she had a severe drinking problem, gambling problem and her stepson was her boyfriend too. He wanted back and realized he loved me and what a horrible mistake he had made. It’s been two years and I do t regret a thing I have said or done. We are getting back on stable ground but its been hard for me. I have wated to throw the towel in many times but I keep sticking it out. Our relationship is getting better everyday but I still think about divorcing him. Too much betrayal. Get a good lawyer and start stashing some money. I would tell her husband but not until he is moved out. Unless of course some one else tells him but you need to think of your safety in that regard not the well being of the OW and her family. That is not your proble. I was so grateful the OW boyfriend called me that night. He also called my H and filled him on on Miss Precious. That was priceless. Be careful.

  13. Karen August 11, 2013 at 12:23 am #

    Thanks, everyone, for your comments and support. I am going to call my lawyer on Monday and check to,see what my moving out will do to my chances of keeping the house. I live in Texas, which is a no fault state, so I’m not sure if it matters who moves out. Everything is split 50-50. I can live in one of those extended stay hotels for a month if I have to… Really need to get settled before school starts. Still wrestling with the pain of letting go since I’ve been with him since I was 16– we were high school sweethearts. I still,have trouble with the fact that he is nothing like the man he used to be— the
    man I loved through high school and college and eventually married… The only lover I’ve ever had…. I want THAT man back so badly, but I know he doesn’t exist anymore. I am so very sad and depressed that it has
    come to this…… But , again, he made a conscious choice to have an affair, even if it was emotional only with no sex—- which I strongly doubt— and h’s had 8 months to make things right and has done nothing but give excuses, lies, and abuse. I truly have no option but to leave and keep,what little of my self respect is left. I am learning that I did nothing to cause this, it was his character flaw, and I am trying to work on myself to become more independent and less codependent. We’ll see how it goes next week with my lawyer.

    • Rachel August 11, 2013 at 11:43 am #

      Yes Karen, we don’t recognize these men that we fell in love with years ago. My boys even said they don’t recognize him and he still looks through them when they speak.
      Good point, this was their decision not ours. Days are difficult still but I have become a different person.
      I love wearing clothing that he despised . It puts a smile on my face. Love my frizzy curly hair because he hated it so. His other thing has straight hair and wears extremely sleazy clothing.
      The freedom is great and I know in the future someone will accept me as me!
      Good luck and remember you are a good person!!

  14. EyesOpened August 11, 2013 at 6:25 am #

    Great news Karen. I was very concerned by your earlier posts – that level of abuse will escalate to something serious – and you won’t see it coming.

    Just to add my two penneth as a CS – my APs w had the courage to tell my h – and she did us ALL a favour in the long run. I didn’t want my h to hurt – so didn’t want her to tell him – but it wasn’t her who hurt him – it was me. I don’t think you should do it as revenge – but as a service to her h.

    I am so sorry for your situation .

  15. Tryinghard August 11, 2013 at 9:22 am #


    You the best. You renew my faith in humanity. I hope you are doing well. BTW how’s the job going?

  16. Karen August 11, 2013 at 3:21 pm #

    Rachel, I wish I could be as positive about the future as you. I’m almost 58…. Who
    Is going to want a person my age? I’m not young, I have wrinkles, and although I’ve dropped 8 sizes since this started and don’t look bad figure-wise, I don’t think I will ever trust another man ever again and won’t be able to have a relationship. He has ruined my future with being able to be with men.

    • Tryinghard August 11, 2013 at 5:11 pm #


      I hear what you are saying. I’m the same age and yes I can’t imagine trusting anyone ever again let alone another man. Right now you have bigger fish to fry. You won’t always feel this way. Once you take Mr Big Hat No Cattle to the cleaners your self esteem will soar. Right now you are feeling beat down because you are! You will become empowered once you go to the attorney. I live in Illinois and although its not a no fault state everything is pretty much divided up 50/50. More times than not women our age have come out better than the 50/50. Don’t be nice in this. Find a good attorney that will let the dogs out! Judges DO pay attention to this crap.

      Wrinkles, big deal. Who doesn’t have wrinkles that doesn’t have substance. Besides Botox is a wonderful product. Spend some of assholes money on some fillers if that will make you feel better. Trust me there are plenty of men out there that are looking for smart good women like you. And know the proverbial ball is in your court. Good luck to you this week. You will be in my prayers.

    • Rachel August 11, 2013 at 5:30 pm #

      Ok Karen , time for a pep talk. I’m 52 and probably look 62. I have many wrinkles a damaged heart and I aso will have a trust issue, with good reason.
      I have only been with one man for 30 years and can’t even imagine myself with another or with the one that I have spent 30 years with.
      I’m sure with time and healing I will fall in love again. Not just yet though. I’m just getting to know me. I was a puppet for 30 years and that puppet no longer exists.
      Be kind to yourself.

  17. Paula August 11, 2013 at 3:36 pm #

    Karen, the last thing you need to worry about is another man at present! Just be. Be Karen. Be the girl who has had to subjugate herself to be in this relationship, hey, even the best relationships have some of this, this sacrifice for the greater good, which is always given to be the relationship. You get to be you, and you sound pretty great! Of course you are low, your self esteem has been badly crushed, but time will show you what you can be – 58 or 88! And when you rediscover that girl, if you still want men to notice, they will. 58 is the new 38, really, it is! Real men see past wrinkles and non-model looks and figure. It is a cliche, but just be the best you. But the first part is finding you again, and letting her slowly shine. You know what they say, the best men come when you are not even looking 😉

  18. EyesOpened August 11, 2013 at 5:32 pm #

    Hey TryingHard! 58?! No way!!! You have a very youthful tone :-). I hope all is well with you – and thank you for asking and caring.

    I left the job with OM two weeks ago and am supposed to be renovating the new house now. First hurdle not jumped yet – cant even get quotes in!! Not sure I’m going to succeed at this new venture – meanwhile paying rent on another house and have lost my income now – so not marvellous. HOWEVER -I am doing a couple of days a week freelancing and getting to spend some precious time over the holidays with my kids ( boy do I owe them that) – so im feeling poor financially but rich in love right now.

    I was wondering how your son is doing? He is so lucky to have you there to support him.

    • Tryinghard August 11, 2013 at 8:38 pm #


      Oh good so glad you made that decision. Freelancing could be great for all of you. The best of both world. Renovating a house can be awful or fun. My business is supplying materials to the building industry so I feel your pain. We are also in the process of building a 5 unit condominium project. Cost are astronomical because of hurricane Sandy last year. Builders seem to be bust too. Patience is the operative word in this process. I used to own a store and we sold french antiques, furniture, accessories and design services. It was great and beautiful. Unfortunately the recession forced us to close. Just a couple of dumb girls in a business that was fun but out of our areas of expertise. I wish I could help you and if you ever need someone to bounce ideas off of let me know.

      LOL thanks for the compliment. I don’t feel 58 and try not to look it either. I love fashion and products that help combat aging. Wanting to go for a few nips and tucks!

      Son is doing good actually dating a really nice girl. Very well educated and travelled. Neve married. Divorce is this month. Had breakfast with my soon to be ex DIL this morning and it was very positive. Both of us cried and hugged. Maybe something good will come of it:)

  19. Karen August 11, 2013 at 6:57 pm #

    Again, thank you all for your support! Just reading what you wrote makes me feel empowered. I just wish I could get to the point of apathy about him, his affair, and the emotional abuse //physical intimidation I have allowed to happen for at least the past 30 years. I take responsibility for that…. My marriage vows said ” for better, for worse” and I took them seriously. I have a masters degree in education, numerous certifications and I still feel like a dummy for having difficulty making the decision to shouldn’t be this difficult, considering the circumstances. I wish I understood ME and why this is happening. And why i still have feelings for the jerk….. Therapy hasn’t brought that out yet…..I feel like a nut case most of the time.

    • Tryinghard August 11, 2013 at 8:41 pm #


      LOL. We are all nut cases but that is beside the point. You’ll get there because you are smart. Just read, read, read and this is really the only place I have found where folks get it.

  20. EyesOpened August 12, 2013 at 2:28 am #

    TH -thank you – what a lovely offer.

    So glad your son is moving on. Your DIL sounds perfect. Crying and hugging are wonderful bonding emotions!!

    It must be be tough in the property and building world at the moment – things seem to be improving in the UK so I hope that applies to you too.

    I still laugh at the ‘word pictures’ you draw of hiking with your h – 10 steps ahead, puffing out of earshot and looking like a French model with a supportive bra!!! You are made of strong stuff TH – and so much fun. I Hope you’re ok inside.

    Thanks for being there and helping me from the beginning – I appreciate your support and wisdom a great deal.

  21. EyesOpened August 12, 2013 at 3:21 am #

    TH – just realised I read your post wrong!! You wrote ‘soon to be ex DIL’ and I read it as ‘soon to be DIL’! OK – so it’s good you have a relationship with her for your grandson – that is so important. It must be hard to be loyal to your son and still show empathy to her – but it helps your grandson and your son. You are amazing.

  22. Tryinghard August 12, 2013 at 10:35 pm #

    Ok so get this. Talk about Karma. Just found out the OW has Stage IV ovarian cancer that has gone to her liver and colon. Now while I wished bad Karma on her I certainly didn’t wish this. I should feel bad but I don’t. I feel bad for not feeling bad. Was torn between telling H but did since we are supposed to be honest. He said he didn’t care. I really saw no emotion from him so I believe he doesn’t care. Vey emotional night for me. More talks and lets just say there’s no more “fog”. He really sees her for the con artist she is. So am I supposed to forgive her before she dies? Because I never have felt a need to forgive her. I can’t believe just last week I posted something about another OW who might be experiencing bad Karma by her insides rotting out and who does it happen to but the OW in my life. This is too surreal to wrap my head around. I mean the whore is going to die!!! Literally….OY now what’s going to happen. Crap what if she wants to contact him now or ME? She has nothing to lose she’s freaking dying. Help you guys

    • exercisegrace August 13, 2013 at 1:25 pm #

      WOW TH, I am speechless….and you know THAT takes alot, LOL!! You absolutely did the right thing by telling him. It would be worse for you both if she had contacted him out of the blue and blindsided him with this. At least now he has time to process how he feels about it, and how he would respond if she did contact him. I don’t see the OW in our case repenting what she did, not even on her death bed. She is so totally hung up on playing the “victim”. I agree with the others, you will have to go with your heart. And the thing is? Knowing you and most of the betrayed spouses here on this board? We have kind, generous hearts. Whatever our knee jerk feeling is, we would probably forgive in this situation. I’m not saying that is right or wrong. I can’t honestly say what I would choose. I can say this, I am working hard at really forgiving my husband and yet I still have anger at times. It makes what he did NO less wrong, no less horrible. it doesn’t take it away. But as I learn to let it go and forgive him more and more, it makes ME feel better. it makes ME feel like I am moving forward in my life and not stuck as the leading actress in this crappy drama that has become my life.

      Read a new favorite quote yesterday:

      “Don’t let someone else hold the pen to your story”

      Peace and blessings

    • forcryin'outloud August 13, 2013 at 2:08 pm #

      Why do you have to forgive her? So she can die in peace or you can live in peace after she is dead? I think that’s the real dilemma here. And honestly TH you don’t have to forgive her until you are good and ready. And that doesn’t have to be before her death.
      I think we need to remember we are not on these women’s radars as breathing real-life humans, we are the obstacle to what they want. Whether that be our partners or our lifestyle or both. I firmly believe they give us little thought as someone with feelings, emotions or as mothers or someone’s cherished loved one.
      I look at the OW as being more a part of my H’s life, she inserted herself in mine without knowledge. I owe her nothing and I don’t want anything from her. The only thing she stirs in me is toxic – hate, anger and contempt. So I feel best not to allow her the opportunity to engage me.
      Have you ever seen “The Descendants” where the cheating dying wife’s lover’s wife comes to see her in the hospital. She comes to offer her sympathy to her H’s OW because her cowardice H won’t do it. Instead she cracks with anger and pain. So, however good the intentions the crime seems to surface triggering hostility. Just a thought.

  23. Strengthrequired August 12, 2013 at 11:57 pm #

    I don’t know what to say TH, I mean your better than I am, I’m not sure I could have told my h, if it was his ow? Yet I’m sure it would ave gotten to him before me anyway. I would have been worried he would race to her side.
    I’m not even sure I know how to forgive my h cousin it.
    I’m glad your h showed you that he doesn’t have feelings anymore, that is a good thing. Yet doesn’t it surprise you how quickly they fall out of love with us, in love with the ow, then back in love with us, and out of love just like tha with the ow.

    Would it really surprise you if your h ow contacted him hoping for sympathy?

    Sorry Hun, wish I knew what to say. You really don’t wish this terrible disease on anyone. Yet I guess karma strike harder then their original strike on us.

    Hang in there…. Cyber hugs.

  24. Karen August 13, 2013 at 12:42 am #

    Wow, not sure what to say on this. I wouldn’t wish cancer on my worst enemy. I understand the difficulty with forgiveness.. I have barely made it to acceptance after 8 months. You just have to do what your heart tells you if she contacts you or your h. If your heart feels like it can forgive, then do so, knowing that you will never forget, but that she will not be in the big picture of your lives anymore. If your heart does not feel you can forgive, then don’t. You do not owe her forgiveness, although she should be begging you for it. I’m sorry you are in this situation. Not an easy one. I wish I could be more help…. You will be in my thoughts

  25. Gizfield August 13, 2013 at 2:01 pm #

    Karen, I’m sorry to hear of your situation. I do have a couple of thoughts on domestic abuse. First, physical abuse ALWAYS includes verbal abuse, and lots of it. my least favorite thing to hear is “I just wish hewould hit me and be done with it, ” not happening, trust me. I think verbal abuse is much more prevalent,.so in most cases, one doesn’t necessarily lead to the other, thank god. I also believe that virtually all cases of infidelity/adultery lead to verbal abuse, at least for a while. They are lying to you, stonewalling, gaslig hting, insulting, etc. I have had many relationships with verbal abusers. Only one with a physical abuser. Without a doubt, for me, there is no comparison. I’ve forgotten about everything he said, but I remember the physical crap like it was yesterday. Maybe on a cellular, primal level or something. If you have ever had a grown man’s fist smash into your face in anger, all I can say is it’s the scariest thing that you can begin to imagine. I’m not saying it’s scarier than some things butit is AWFUL. Take care of yourself, please.

  26. tryinghard August 13, 2013 at 2:52 pm #

    Thanks all for your wise words. I’m glad I told him and we talked a lot last night. Didn’t sleep well and had dreams all night long. I think this is what they call a paradigm shift in psychology. Her impending death is huge. My H may act like it’s not and he is being super attentive and supportive. He said if she were to call him about her health he would say “I’m sorry to hear that for you. Please don’t ever call me again.” OK now that seems pretty harmless and positive and SOOOO like him because he always has to be the good little boy where I would like him to say “I don’t care if you live or die bitch!” I know, I know not nice. I don’t want to be nice to her even if she is sick and dying. Just think she has had a total hysterectomy and a colostomy. Really what threat is she to me. Her sex drive is GONE and she has to crap in a bag through a hole in her stomach!!! She’s going to be going through some wicked chemo. I guess this is KARMA?! I always knew she was pathetic but this takes the cake.

    I’m not driven to forgive her and you are right I guess I can do it even if she’s dead. I think what I worry about most is how will this change for me and my H’s relationship. Now that she is no longer here on earth to worry about will I even care if I stay with him? Maybe this will just be the final straw in the affair? I’ve never been short on empathy even with people I don’t know but I swear I’m almost giddy over this and I HATE THAT I FEEL THIS WAY!!! I just want to say to her now “Serves you the F right. You are getting what you deserve.” And you know what that is just no way for ANY human to be. HHHMMM, let’s see how can I blame this one on my Husband?????

    I can say for all of you wanting the bloodiest worst kind of revenge on the OW I think this just might be it and it sure is hard to wrap my head around!

    • Strengthrequired August 13, 2013 at 5:16 pm #

      The best thing about karma, it’s not done by your hand.

      You know what I’m struggling with TH, my h being away now 5 nights a week, I’m worried that although I love him dearly, that I’m starting to shut myself down emotionally, so I don’t feel pain anymore. I’m somewhat confused, am I building a wall, or am I starting to trust?

      • tryinghard August 13, 2013 at 5:56 pm #

        That’s a great point. My H and I were laughing last night that at least when she dies it won’t be because he or I killed her!!! Yes we have warped senses of humor. She absolutely did this to herself. She has terrible health habits. He told me she had little or no regard for her life or anyone else’s ( so what the hell did he see in her?)

        I don’t Strength. Maybe it’s a little of both? We have to come to a point where we say and think..look he’s a grown man that can make a decision one way or the other. We know what they are capable of so I don’t think it’s total trust. Maybe you are just moving on personally. There has to come a point where you just give up the ghost right? I don’t think you are building a wall you just have better and more important things to focus on. But what do I know??

  27. Strengthrequired August 13, 2013 at 6:28 pm #

    That’s not warped sense of humor, I thought the same. Lol

    Thanks TH, I think I’m numb, but in a way I’m thinking maybe I’m still trying to be the strong one, because I know my h is still quite stressed. He wants and needs a break, but can’t because of our financials. We speak several times a day, and he always sounds so sad. Yet when he is home, he laughs, plays with the kids and gets some well deserved rest.

  28. Gizfield August 13, 2013 at 9:02 pm #

    Ona lighter note, I have some good news tonight. The Whore Mobile is gone. when my husband was pursuing his Lady Love, he could no longer be seen driving his ugly wortype van so he traded it on for a Ford Blazer. I found emails where he told the tramp about it, and even sent her photos. Ewwwww. About a month before his I am in love with someone else speech, we made a sudden trip to florida. I guess it was some kind of test or something. My last chance lol. That was the only time I ever drove this vehicle. It was raining, dark, a big new vehicle, and I could not see. I have bad vision anyway. Mr.wonderful asked me if there was “a special reason I was driving below the speed limit”. Jerk!! Did I mention the speed limitkept changing cause wewere going through small towns. It was the most hateful he had every

    • Strengthrequired August 13, 2013 at 9:18 pm #

      Talking about cars, we got rid of our Holden after I hated being in it, since he would drag his cousin it around in it. I remember being in the car with her one day, and she would lay her leg across the back seat, not sit like a normal person. Yet after his I love someone else’s speech, I hated that car, knowing that she sat her shitty ass in it, putting her greasy hands over it as if she had won the lotto, it made me sick.
      So glad we got rid of it, yet I had to tell my h that cousin it was never to step a foot inside this new car.
      What is it, that anything the ow had touched makes us want to rid ourselves of it. As I’m sure the new car would have had her eyes glued and butt glued to the seat, because she is materialistic.

    • chiffchaff August 14, 2013 at 7:45 am #

      I made my H get rid of clothes and a travel washbag that he’d taken to her apartment when he visited her there. couldn’t bear to look at something I knew had been in her house or hung on the back of her bathroom door. silly stuff. certainly cheaper to get rid of than a car!

      • Strengthrequired August 14, 2013 at 8:58 am #

        I wanted my h to change his phone number but we can’t because it’s a business number. We moved house because I couldn’t stand my home anymore, she had been in it, the suburb we lived, couldn’t breathe just being there. My h would take me out and all I could think of was did you bring her here, I just couldn’t handle it, too vulnerable to handle it. At least where I live, I’m at peace, well more than I was anyway.

        • chiffchaff August 14, 2013 at 12:17 pm #

          I can sympathise with that.
          Whenever we’re in London I constantly want to ask ‘have you been here before?’ i.e. with her? and when tourist places in California or Boston are on the tv it’s also a thoguht in my head ‘did he go there with her?’.
          My H knows that what he did has seriously messed with my thought processes on some things.

  29. Gizfield August 13, 2013 at 9:11 pm #

    He had ever been to me. The thing broke down in February and that is when his dad died and he got his car sd part of the estate. So the Whore mobile has been in my driveway since then. I just know her nasty ass has been in it. if not, at the least it is where they had most of their long, soulful cell phone conversations. I’m surprised hes not dead cause he is a horrible driver while on the phone. Now it is gone. Like someone said earlier, ya’ll are the only ones who would understand. I hated that whore transporting junk heap. Good riddance. I didnt say anything but I’m sure one day I will. Lol.

  30. Strengthrequired August 13, 2013 at 9:23 pm #

    I hated ours too, so glad it’s gone….. Every time I sat in it, I would look for her shit in there, and look at finger prints on the windows or something. Ewwwww. Ooooohhhhhh she makes me sick.
    Yay for your whore mobile having left the driveway for good. Ohh and yes the calls, being made in the car, their love calls. Honestly what the hell can you talk about for hours at a time several times a day, surely they weren’t that interesting.

  31. Gizfield August 13, 2013 at 9:23 pm #

    About the Karma thing, unfortunately I would probably feel bad for her. I hate for anyone to be sick especially with cancer. I’ve lost lots of family and friends to it and it just makes me sick tohear that anyone has it. I totally despise my husband’s skunt, but what I would like is for her to live to be really old, and get more nasty looking and ugly every year. The outside to match the nasty inside. oh, and hope her daughter to go down the path SHE set her on. And for any potential boyfriends/husband s to know her for the slut she is. I would be estatic.

  32. Gizfield August 13, 2013 at 9:30 pm #

    I knew you’d understand, lol! Iftheir phone conversations were anywhere near as stupid as their emails, I’m just glad I wasn’t participating in them ! I hate phone calls anyway. I have ALL my cell minutes left at the end of the month.

  33. Strengthrequired August 13, 2013 at 10:58 pm #

    Definately understand giz, lol.

    I’m the same, I too have lost alot of family members to cancer, so wishing it on anyone, I just couldn’t. I too would prefer my h ow’s ugliness to shine inside and out and for her to live a long life knowing that people see her ugliness. For her to witness her daughter go down the same path, it would be something else for her to be ashamed off, knowing she should have shown her daughter the right ways of treating people, not wrong ways.

  34. Gizfield August 13, 2013 at 11:55 pm #

    Today would have been my late husband’s 64th birthday. He died in 1999, one month before his fiftieth birthday. Drank himself to death, although official cause of death was cardiomegaly or enlarged heart. I remember for weeks beforehand of him complaining about turning 50 and being old. Seems kind of Karma like…

  35. Strengthrequired August 14, 2013 at 1:02 am #

    Im sorry giz, you have witnessed alot.

    I’m still sitting here waiting for karma to hit cousin it, I just wonder will I ever hear about it through the grape vine. Noticing karma hitting a few of these ow here, I’m sure it will eventually happen.
    I was watching “give it a year”. Today, both the h and w cheated within the year of marriage, I’m surprised I sa through it actually.
    Marriage just seems to be taken less seriously now a days, they know if it gets too hard then they can just divorce,

  36. livingonafence August 14, 2013 at 12:33 pm #

    OK, why do you need to forgive someone because she’s dying? I don’t see any connection here. You don’t need to forgive her ever. She would have been quite happy to destroy your life intentionally. You didn’t intentionally have her killed. She is sick. She’s dying. Not your fault. Despite popular culture, someone dying does not make them a saint – it makes them dead. Bad people die too. You don’t have to enjoy it, or maybe you do. That’s your call. We aren’t bad people for not caring about the death of someone that tried to destroy the life we built. Where does this feeling come from? Please don’t buy into it.

    Karen, please, tell that woman’s husband. Who cares what your H thinks. If that man were the one to discover it, would you want him to call you? Your H is absolutely protecting her, and right now, if your only reason for not telling is your H, you’re helping him. Yes, you’re helping to protect the other woman. I hope your H is thanking you.

    Karma hit my OW big time. First her aunt died. Fitting since my H told me it was his aunt he was talking to. Then her dog died. Then her mother died. Now her sister has cancer. It’s been a rough 2 years for this woman. Do I care? Not at all. I can’t think of a more deserving person.

    Do I feel badly for being that cold? Nope. Why should I? I have no love for this person. She’s a liar, and she would be tickled pink if my H had left me for her. She had zero concern for my happiness or the life I built. Why on earth should I care about her life? I don’t.

  37. Karen August 14, 2013 at 12:51 pm #

    My therapist tells me I am only hurting myself by telling her husband and that I am doing it out of revenge. I had never been a vengeful person before the affair….and I am finding that I do not like that part of myself. I don’t want to sink to her level. And what if her husband already knows? Or what if MY husband has painted me as some crazy bitch that would say anything and the slut’s husband ignores me or doesn’t believe me? Or worse yet, comes after me? He seems to be a kind godly man, but I only know what I have heard about him. I’ve never met him. My H has begged me several times not to destroy their marriage….while not seeming to give a flying flip about ours. He seems to think she will eventually destroy her own marriage. Believe me, I want nothing more than to “out” this affair AND the one they had 18 years ago, but Karma has a way of coming back to bite you in the butt!!! I don’t need anything to backfire on me. What I consider a ” service” by telling her husband, my therapist says is just a vengeful act that will serve no purpose other than to make me feel worse. I am torn between what I feel is justice and what I should morally do. I hate this feeling.

    • livingonafence August 14, 2013 at 3:23 pm #

      Your therapist is a moron. How are you hurting yourself by helping this man with the truth?
      Regarding the other items you list – you’ve bought into the list of ‘what if’ reasons not to tell. I go back to what I said – if he knew and you didn’t would you want him to tell you? Or would you prefer that everyone but you know and later you can feel like a fool? It isn’t revenge, it’s the decent thing to do. There are no what ifs. He wouldn’t come after you. Where did you even come up with that?
      I won’t go on – you do what you want, but your therapist is clearly a ‘move on, don’t look back’ person. You aren’t hurting yourself by letting him in on their dirty secret, but you certainly are helping her.
      Best of luck.It is NOT immoral to help a man learn the truth when others are deceiving him. I’m sorry you’ve been fed such lies about honesty by these deceitful people.

  38. Tryinghard August 14, 2013 at 12:57 pm #

    You are right. No she didn’t give two shots when I was I the psych ward at the hospital. She didn’t give a shit to even answer her phone one time when I was frantically worried my husband had a heart attack and he was at her house. All those weeks I was suffering she never once took me into consideration. She as only concerned about herself. No she will die and no she will not become a saint. I do hope she suffers like I did and I hope she rots in hell. She insinuated herself in my life when she should have been taking care of herself doing the right thing. I didn’t do this to her and I didn’t wish it on her. But she’s sick and she and her family will face that she was a useless good for nothing whore who never did one moral or productive thing in her life. Thanks living for helping me decide what the next step will be should she contact me or my husband. I’m over it. I feel no need to forgive her alive or dead.

    • livingonafence August 14, 2013 at 3:31 pm #

      There you go. If you want to forgive her, you do it. But why? Because she’s dying and we need to be nice to dying people? Bullshit. You don’t need to taunt her, but you don’t need to decide she deserves to be forgiven because she’s dying, and you do NOT need to see her in a new light. She’s the same as she always was. She’s just sick now. Nothing else has changed. She hasn’t called begging for forgiveness right? And if she does? So what – you don’t owe her anything.
      Don’t you dare feel guilty for not caring that she’s sick. You didn’t cause it, and she never did one single thing out of consideration for you.

      • tryinghard August 14, 2013 at 3:49 pm #

        I love you..will you marry me:) Oh yeah and it’s become clear what I’m going to talk to H about tonight. He hates for anyone to think bad of him. He wants to avoid conflict. I am certain she is going to reach out now or even me. I want him ready.

        If you are going to divorce your H anyway who cares if he knows or not. I agree with what everyone said but if it is going to cause more stress for you and you’re scared, don’t do it. Trust me you won’t feel bad if you do. And no it is not an act of revenge. Poor guy someone needs to tell him. How would you like it if everyone knew and didn’t tell you making you an even bigger cuckold than you already were?? Even if you did it anonymously he has a right to know as an act of kindness. Hell no ignorance is not bliss. HHMMM I might be looking for a new therapist. Did you find the lawyer on Monday?

      • tryinghard August 14, 2013 at 3:51 pm #

        Crap you mean I can’t send a card that says HAHAHA you have cancer???? You are NO FUN!

  39. Gizfield August 14, 2013 at 1:04 pm #

    Karen, THATS what I hate about therapists. They always want to shift the blame and burden from where it belongs to the victim. I doubt your husband is this chick’s only “rodeo”. No telling what diseases she is carrying. Her husband deserves to know, in my opinion. Your husband doesn’t want him interferring on the affair to keep it easy for himself. You are not ruining her marriage. She is ruining her marriage by BEING a whore. Dont feel any guilt over this shit !

    • livingonafence August 14, 2013 at 3:28 pm #

      GREAT POINT!! I told the OW’s H. He thought she was little miss innocent. Well, he started watching after we spoke. She did it again. Then again, and the third guy became physical. He threw her out.
      And yes, he is eternally grateful for me for telling him the truth. It hurt like hell, but not knowing is worse.

      EDIT: I say third man. It was the third he knew about. Who knows how many it really was.

  40. Mona Lisa August 14, 2013 at 1:07 pm #

    Karen, it’s easy for someone sitting behind a desk to tell you what you should or should not be doing concerning this affair. Of course your therapist is not going to advise you to tell the husband. If the thrapist told you to call him and it all went south and someone got hurt, the therapist may be vicariously responsible. It’s called CYA for these so called professionals. There is no blanket rule for this! I called the husband, insisted my H sit and listen to the conversation, and even gave him my Husbands cell phone number so if he wanted to ask any other questions. Revenge??? Hey, these Cheaters should think about the fallout. It’s all fun and games until….

  41. tryinghard August 14, 2013 at 3:52 pm #

    I just know I am going to be hit by a bus tomorrow for being so wicked!! I better start praying now for my own immortal soul!

    • Strengthrequired August 14, 2013 at 5:17 pm #

      Why is it those of us that have morals, worry so much that karma will hit us so quickly, like tomorrow? Just look how long it has taken for karma to hit the ow/om in our lives, that is if it has already? It has taken ages, and these people had no regard for our feelings, no remorse, they left behind them mass destruction in our lives, and still it takes a long time for karma.
      So Hun, we may think ba of these ow/om in our lives, we may say things here or to others about how much we despise these low lives, but that’s just it, it’s talk, we haven’t physically set out to hurt these people, we haven’t set out to destroy their lives like they did.
      So I would say, don’t worry about that bus tomorrow, we probably have another 20 yrs on top of their karma hitting.
      Well hopefully anyway, we have plenty of time to pray for our souls….. Lol

      • Strengthrequired August 14, 2013 at 5:30 pm #

        Or maybe we have paid our dues, because of all the suffering caused to us.

  42. Gizfield August 14, 2013 at 5:15 pm #

    Trying hard, I am of the opinion that no one is obligated to forgive anyone at anytime. Definitely a personal choice. My husbands skank is a vile ass excuse for a human being. I’d spit on her ass in hell before I’d forgive her. She or my husband showed no real remorse for their bullshit. Haven’t forgiven him either, but I might spit on him on hell. Still undecided on that one, lol.

  43. Karen August 14, 2013 at 5:31 pm #

    All of my “what ifs” came from my therapist. He really is a good Christian man who is trying to make me see the other side of my vengeance and he is trying to make me see that the relief i think i might get may not materialize like i think it will.There could be unexpected fallout.I have decided that the minute I file for divorce, I will text all three of her phone numbers that I have seen on my husbands phone records ( one of them belongs to her husband) and announce to her exactly her part in the demise of my 35 year marriage and discuss all,the phone records and other evidence I have. The H will see it and he can take it from there. Theirs is an emotional affair and I have no proof that it has become physical, so I have to be careful what I say and how I phrase it. I hate that I want revenge so badly, but I have suffered for 8 months waiting to see if my abusive cheating lying POS husband will come to his senses. Time is up. Moving out for a while and then moving on, unless a miracle from God himself happens, which I don’t anticipate because abusers dont change.

    Tryinghard, yes I got my lawyer and it doesn’t matter if I move out. I can still ask for the house and half of our other assets.
    And don’t feel wicked about your feelings. She does not deserve your forgiveness. I know that if I ever get to the point of forgiveness, it will be a very long time in the future. 8 months is a long time to watch someone suffer and my H has watched and not done one thing to help me heal, even though he has had chance after chance. I am sad to leave a man who I’ve been with since I was 16, but it is painfully obvious he no longer loves me and is only hanging on to keep his assets. I cannot forgive him now for this second affair with the same slutty woman…. And may never get to that point. Oh, did I mention that she has had cancer also? Seems to be in remission now…. If she truly ever really had it. It could be something my H made up….that’s what he did the first time to justify his 77 calls in a month to her.

    • Rachel August 14, 2013 at 6:09 pm #

      Karen, I wouldn’t text the g.f anything. You may need this information in court if you go to trial. Don’t waste your time with her. Your story is so similar to mine. Married 25 years dated for 5. It hurts like he’ll. I know. As my 82 year old mother says” bite your tongue and count to 10. So hard but I’ve done it.
      My husbands soulmate has cancer too!!! She has melanoma.
      I wanted to send her a sun lamp but my lawyer said to wait until after the divorce is final.
      Keep your head up and keep strong. You are so much better then them!!! Remember karma. It will get you through the day.

    • Strengthrequired August 14, 2013 at 6:24 pm #

      Karen, can I just say I’m sorry for what you are going through. No one deserves the pain and heartache that any of us have been through. These ow and om in our lives didn’t care about how we would feel about their involvement with our spouses.
      Did I understand this wring ? Did you say she sent a email to you, but it showed on your h phone, but meant for your h?
      If she did, she meant for you to see it.
      I would like to say, that I would like to know if my h was cheating? No one told me, he was on holiday, and had his ow fly overseas to meet him there, which is where their ea started. He thought he was doing a good deed for her by buying her a ticket so she could see her family. In the end she threw herself at him with her families help.
      I did not know anything until my h came back from holiday and told me he was inkive with someone else.
      I felt foolish, yet I still fought for my marriage.
      My point is, I would have preferred someone tell me what was going on behind my back, if you are clueless, you can’t try and repair the damage that has been inflicted on your marriage, your choice at either fighting for your marriage or leaving it is tsken away and left in the hands of the cheaters.
      Even if it was done without you saying who you are, or having someone else expose his wife. I’m just saying this man deserves the right to choose his path.
      You said your moving out, maybe that is the perfect time for you to expose her to her husband, and to let him know that you have separated from your h due to their ea. Maybe just say, you had a hard time trying to find the right words and the right moment to let him know of his wife’s ea, you wanted to do the right thing by him earlier but your h had pleaded with you to not destroy her marriage, but as you thought more about it, after giving your marriage and your h a chance to make things right by you and your family, you just couldn’t sit back and be a witness to the destruction of another persons life without him knowing. The more you thought about it, you realized it wasn’t you breaking her marriage, she is the one doing the breaking.
      If he requests proof then show him..

      Again we can only be here to support you, this decision is completely in your hands, and I don’t envy your position. Look after yourself, you are the most important thing right now. Just know it isn’t revenge informing someone of their spouses betrayal.
      Cyber hugs

  44. Gizfield August 14, 2013 at 5:38 pm #

    Karen, exposing shit this woman did to someone also affected by it is NOT REVENGE! Beating her ass or destroying her property might be, I dont know, but that is beside the point. The therapistis not giving you good advice.

  45. Tryinghard August 14, 2013 at 7:37 pm #

    Ok so here’s what I’ve figured out. I give up on this forgiveness thing. I’ve tried and I just don’t think I’m going to get there so I QUIT. I’ve prayed my ass off and still nothing. God is just going to have to take me as I am. I’ve tried He knows I’ve tried and that’s all I care about. I freaking tried. I’m just going to accept that I’m an idiot because I am choosing to stay with a big fat liar and a cheater but its my choice. I also don’t give a crap if she has cancer and suffers. I’ve suffered for many years not just since DDay because of the part she played in my life. Who knows I could be filled with cancer too and not know and she sure as hell wouldn’t lose any sleep over it. So eff her and her immortal soul. She has a higher Being to answer to. I’ve had enough bad karma in the last 10 years to make any enemy jump for joy and I’m sure she did! Looks like we may even lose our business! No thanks to all the cash he payed out to her. Freaking dumbass! Life’s going to deal me whatever cards it wants to and I’m going to keep putting one foot in front of the other trying my best. All I know is I don’t deserve any of this but I am paying a big price. I didn’t ask for any of it and I’ve been a good wife, mother, sister, friend, employer you name it. Life is not fair and so be it. Just needed to vent.

    • Strengthrequired August 14, 2013 at 7:57 pm #

      We are struggling too, possibly could lose more than our business unfortunately. So I feel your pain.

  46. Gizfield August 14, 2013 at 7:49 pm #

    Hey, my big “sin” was being 50 years old, weighing 180 pounds, and not being up to snuff in the house keeping department. Of course, I did have a full time job, and a five year old. Certainly justification for running around with a whore behind my back, don’t you think?

  47. Tryinghard August 14, 2013 at 9:19 pm #

    Yeah giz. I know about the wright and trying your best with a family and job. Life goes on right.

  48. Tryinghard August 14, 2013 at 9:22 pm #

    Don’t know if I’ll be back for a while. All of you take care. Hope life finds better cards for all of you. Don’t know why people make the dumbass choices the make but I guess that’s the mystery of olive. Love to all of you. Peace

    • Strengthrequired August 14, 2013 at 9:59 pm #

      Take care TH, please look after yourself….

  49. Gizfield August 14, 2013 at 9:23 pm #

    Absolutely, TH, I’m working like a damn slave, he had time to pursue a whore, and hes the one “not getting their needs met.” Seriously, dude ????

  50. Gizfield August 14, 2013 at 9:25 pm #

    You too, take care as well.

  51. Karen August 15, 2013 at 12:38 am #

    TH, I am at the same point as you are about forgiveness. I am ready to quit too. No remorse, no heartfelt apology from him, saying on DDay that he won’t give her up….why bother with forgiveness? I can only reach acceptance and barely even that. I feel I’ve been a good wife and mother too…. Held a full time job, came home and had dinner cooked and ready for him, brought it to him on the sofa so he could watch tv, helped him through several college degrees by revising and typing research papers, took care of two little boys and helped them with homework, signed my name to a loan for farmland because HE wanted it, and the thanks I get is 30 years of verbal abuse, 2ea’s with the same woman, more emotional abuse which has escalated into physical and then told to ” get over it”. No, I do not think forgiveness is in my future. Thank you for your posts… You have helped me with your perspective on it all. Take care of yourself!

    • livingonafence August 15, 2013 at 5:54 am #

      Karen, letting this man in on the lies is not revenge. It is the right thing to do. Again, if he had discovered this, would you want him to let you know?
      I’m sorry, but your therapist is a moron. If the OM had discovered my H’s EA, I would absolutely have wanted him to contact me. I contacted him, straight away, and he is extremely thankful to this day. He knows he was living a complete lie and being used. I’m the only person that stood up and told him.
      People exposed in affairs don’t come after anyone. They hide because their dirty secret is out. The real them has been exposed, and just like a cockroach running from the light, they run for cover.

  52. Gizfield August 15, 2013 at 7:46 am #

    I always love the”cockroach” analogy cause my husbands Gf referred to herself as a cockroach and that she would “survive”, lol. She is one too, hiding on the shadows. She set up a facebook page after he finally, supposedly, told her good bye and she doesn’t even have a photo on there. To shield us mortals from her beauty, I guess. Thefunny thing is, her behavior reminds me of my Affair Partner from all those years ago. Very sleazy, serial cheater. I bet in most affairs, there is one

  53. Gizfield August 15, 2013 at 7:51 am #

    I bet there is one partner who has never cheated, and one who has before. it wood be interesting to see statistics on that. The cockroaches know how to play it, who seems susceptible, what to say, what to do. That doesn’t absolve either party of complete guilt but it helps explain why ,”good people do bad things.”

  54. JessieR July 21, 2017 at 1:42 pm #

    Six months after D day (3 month emotional/web based then sexual affair), I woke, for the first time, thinking I can get through this. We had spent the previous evening going through the last of my questions (at the moment!) and I was convinced we were on the right track. We had already agreed no contact whatsoever, that he would tell me if she tried to contact him, we would reply ‘together’ if she did and he would be completely honest from now on. The next day, as part of his new ‘honesty’ he told me he had in fact received multiple texts/emails/gifts from her in the last 6 months and not told me – to ‘protect me’. He had even met her once, in public for 5 mins, just three weeks before so he could get ‘closure’. He had kept the gifts (including poetry she had written for him) “as a reminder not to be so stupid again” – yeah, right. He handed them all to me (he had already deleted all texts and emails) and I burned them (without reading – I havebeen hurt enough already thanks). I have found this last 6 weeks hardest of all – I was so close to forgiving him and I am feeling emotionally numb. My brain knows I still love him but my heart cant seem to feel it. I dont know whether I can do this again. Am I being unreasonable? Any advice appreciated – please!

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